I for one approve of the fact that a man named 'R.A. Dickey' is now a footnote in baseball history.

It baffles me why pitchers only consider learning the knuckleball when their careers are in jeopardy. Teams should be teaching it in the low minors just in case somebody can harness it.

Gosling: I for one approve of the fact that a man named 'R.A. Dickey' is now a footnote in baseball history.

If he keeps going the way he is going, he's going to be a lot more than a footnote. He has a chance to eclipse some records that were seen as untouchable and set standards that would be jaw dropping.

Hoopy Frood: It baffles me why pitchers only consider learning the knuckleball when their careers are in jeopardy. Teams should be teaching it in the low minors just in case somebody can harness it.

Cause starting at a very early age pitchers are told that all that matters is throwing hard. They're taught to be power pitchers instead of control pitchers or knuckleball pitchers cause that's just how certain people insist it has to be.

Dude better be starting the all star game.

Hoopy Frood: It baffles me why pitchers only consider learning the knuckleball when their careers are in jeopardy. Teams should be teaching it in the low minors just in case somebody can harness it.

Because knuckle-ball pitchers are notorious .500 record guys. Dickey is just having a great run. But I wouldn't rely in his performance to continue at this level in the second half.

The Mets aren't trying to get this one bumped up to a no-hitter, too, are they?

Who has had him on his fantasy keeper league since a waiver wire pick up last year? This guy!

/I know, I know, it's fantasy baseball
//Wouldn't pay attention to the Mets otherwise

WhyteRaven74: Cause starting at a very early age pitchers are told that all that matters is throwing hard. They're taught to be power pitchers instead of control pitchers or knuckleball pitchers cause that's just how certain people insist it has to be.

There is nothing controlled about a knuckleball. I was a catcher in high school (giggity) and we had a kid who's dad loved Phil Niekro so he taught his kid to throw the knuckler. Bob Uecker had it right on the best way to catch a knuckleball: "Wait until it stops rolling and then go pick it up".

/I hated that kid's dad

WhyteRaven74: Gosling: I for one approve of the fact that a man named 'R.A. Dickey' is now a footnote in baseball history.

If he keeps going the way he is going, he's going to be a lot more than a footnote. He has a chance to eclipse some records that were seen as untouchable and set standards that would be jaw dropping.

Yes, he's got a chance. As long as the wind never blows in ever again.

Hoopy Frood: It baffles me why pitchers only consider learning the knuckleball when their careers are in jeopardy. Teams should be teaching it in the low minors just in case somebody can harness it.

The Indians are developing a pretty good knuckleballer. Steven Wright was pretty much just a run-of-the-mill minor league pitcher who was a longshot to make the majors. Then, before last year, he decides he wants to be a knuckleballer. He'd been fooling with it for awhile, but decided to really focus on it for the last two years. The results? He might be earning himself a shot at the majors soon, and has been praised by former knuckleballer Tom Candiotti as being one of the best he's seen.

I love it that there's a knuckleballer having some success. When they have that pitch going for them, I don't think there's anything as fun in baseball as watching a big slugger get frustrated at a sub-70 mph pitch.

SurfaceTension: Hoopy Frood: It baffles me why pitchers only consider learning the knuckleball when their careers are in jeopardy. Teams should be teaching it in the low minors just in case somebody can harness it.

Because knuckle-ball pitchers are notorious .500 record guys. Dickey is just having a great run. But I wouldn't rely in his performance to continue at this level in the second half.

Yea but they can chew up innings without wearing down their arm as much. That's a bit more valuable than just some .500 pitcher.

madden101: The Mets aren't trying to get this one bumped up to a no-hitter, too, are they?

Terry Collins joked about that in his post game press conference, said "Do I have a chance to appeal that base hit? Did anybody dive for that ball? I had a bad view".

Cubs300: Who has had him on his fantasy keeper league since a waiver wire pick up last year? This guy!

/I know, I know, it's fantasy baseball
//Wouldn't pay attention to the Mets otherwise

They're actually pretty fun, even if they're not a juggernaut. But putting aside Dickey, the fact that Ike Davis is now hitting couldn't be more encouraging. The Mets have done this well so far with a Davis start that redefined the word "horrendous."

babysealclubber: I love it that there's a knuckleballer having some success. When they have that pitch going for them, I don't think there's anything as fun in baseball as watching a big slugger get frustrated at a sub-70 mph pitch.

The crazy thing with Dickey is that he can get his knuckler around 80. People who have seen a lot more baseball than I have keep saying they've never seen anything like it.

As a Met fan, baseball is fun again.

Ima10urin8: As a Met fan, baseball is fun again.

It was definitely fun over the last weekend.

/Reds fan

Ham Sandvich: Yea but they can chew up innings without wearing down their arm as much. That's a bit more valuable than just some .500 pitcher.

In that it can save your bullpen? Yeah, there is that. But the question wasn't on the value of knuckleball pitchers, but rather why more pitchers don't throw the pitch.

SurfaceTension: Ham Sandvich: Yea but they can chew up innings without wearing down their arm as much. That's a bit more valuable than just some .500 pitcher.

In that it can save your bullpen? Yeah, there is that. But the question wasn't on the value of knuckleball pitchers, but rather why more pitchers don't throw the pitch.

The answer is simple: Learning the pitch to the point that you can throw it with any reliability is very time-consuming and really farking hard.

Cubs300: Who has had him on his fantasy keeper league since a waiver wire pick up last year? This guy!

/I know, I know, it's fantasy baseball
//Wouldn't pay attention to the Mets otherwise

I picked him up at the 15 scoreless innings streak he was on. Currently the #3 player ranked. Looking to trade him for a couple of proven commodities.

Have they figured out how he is cheating yet? I am guessing sandpaper...

/i keed

If we don't get an NFL Bounty greenlight today I'm going to be pissed.

They released the evidence against the Saints and it's damning, as we all expected. I'm praying to see a bunch of ignored posts from Robsul with him moving the goalposts another dozen or so times!

It's amazing that he throws the knuckler at about 80 MPH, which is unheard of. The movement he gets on it looks a lot like a cutter.

It's a great story. The guy's been to Hell and back and deserves the run he's been on.

FreakinB: The crazy thing with Dickey is that he can get his knuckler around 80. People who have seen a lot more baseball than I have keep saying they've never seen anything like it.

It's a "hard knuckleball", which is easier to throw for strikes because it doesn't move as much (not as much time). It was rather common in the 40s but was extinct for decades. I think the only reason why no one else throws it is because high school and college baseball coaches are farking dumbasses who let it go extinct. It's a very effective pitch; I've never seen it but supposedly it breaks like a wobbling forkball.

That's probably the only reason I like baseball anymore. It's the one sport where you can actually succeed with a lost art.

Johnny Vander Meer smirks.

lacydog: Hoopy Frood: It baffles me why pitchers only consider learning the knuckleball when their careers are in jeopardy. Teams should be teaching it in the low minors just in case somebody can harness it.

The Indians are developing a pretty good knuckleballer. Steven Wright was pretty much just a run-of-the-mill minor league pitcher who was a longshot to make the majors. Then, before last year, he decides he wants to be a knuckleballer. He'd been fooling with it for awhile, but decided to really focus on it for the last two years. The results? He might be earning himself a shot at the majors soon, and has been praised by former knuckleballer Tom Candiotti as being one of the best he's seen.

Unfortunately he lives on a one-way dead-end street, so he'll never be able to get to the park.

dragonchild: FreakinB: The crazy thing with Dickey is that he can get his knuckler around 80. People who have seen a lot more baseball than I have keep saying they've never seen anything like it.

It's a "hard knuckleball", which is easier to throw for strikes because it doesn't move as much (not as much time). It was rather common in the 40s but was extinct for decades. I think the only reason why no one else throws it is because high school and college baseball coaches are farking dumbasses who let it go extinct. It's a very effective pitch; I've never seen it but supposedly it breaks like a wobbling forkball.

That's probably the only reason I like baseball anymore. It's the one sport where you can actually succeed with a lost art.

The reason why nobody throws it is because it is hard as hell to control and just about everybody that tries to learn it can't control it consistently enough. And it was about as common in the 40's as it was in the 70's and 80's.

Hoopy Frood: It baffles me why pitchers only consider learning the knuckleball when their careers are in jeopardy. Teams should be teaching it in the low minors just in case somebody can harness it.

Prevailing wisdom, which isn't necessarily right, is that part of what makes a knuckleball effective is that there are 1 or 2 guys in all of MLB throwing it at any given time. If lots and lots of guys threw it, batters would bother to take batting practice against it, and eventually it'll get treated like any other ~75mph pitch that is thrown too often.

I think it's hard to disguise with a 'normal' fastball. Dickey's fastball velocity dropped by ~6mph since he started throwing the knuckler. It's possible that you'd telegraph a knuckler if you tried to mix it in as a "surprise" pitch.

FreakinB: The crazy thing with Dickey is that he can get his knuckler around 80. People who have seen a lot more baseball than I have keep saying they've never seen anything like it.

The really strange thing with Dickey is that he's a guy who struck out ~5.5 guys per 9 until his 36th birthday, and this year he's striking out 9.4 per 9. (He embraced the kunckleball starting in 2008, and started throwing it often in 2010.) Right now, his 103 strikeouts are ahead of guys named Strasburg, Gonzalez, and Cain.

Checking PitchFx:
- It claims he hasn't changed the frequency of his knuckleball recently-- he threw it 83% and 76% of the time in his first two years with the Mets, and this year he's back to 83%.
- His average velocity is up, but only a tick-- he was throwing it 76mph the last two years, and this year he's at 77mph.
- His average movement isn't appreciably different-- maybe an inch more 'rise' this year. Of course, with knuckleballer it's not so much the average as the variance, and that's harder to look at without doing some serious digging.
- He's throwing it in the strike zone 53% of the time, just as he was in 2010 and 2011.

Despite all this, Dickey's results are very different-- batters are swinging much more often at out-of-zone pitches (35% vs. 27% career), and they're missing the ball more often, both in and out of the zone. His walk rate is down, but it's not because he's throwing more strikes-- it's because batters are chasing junk more often.

He's 37 years old, and has caught fire for a couple months. I hate to say it, but my gut says to trade him while his value is this high. He's not doing anything obviously different. If he had suddenly boosted his velocity or control, I'd say to wait and see.

It's entirely possible that he 'mastered' the pitch this year and is placing it better, disguising it better, studying batters more closely, etc. It's also possible that he has more variation in velocity and break which isn't showing up in the averages. But absent that kind of evidence showing up, history says you're generally safer betting against "late bloomers", as fun as this story is.

chimp_ninja: He's 37 years old, and has caught fire for a couple months. I hate to say it, but my gut says to trade him while his value is this high. He's not doing anything obviously different. If he had suddenly boosted his velocity or control, I'd say to wait and see.

It's entirely possible that he 'mastered' the pitch this year and is placing it better, disguising it better, studying batters more closely, etc. It's also possible that he has more variation in velocity and break which isn't showing up in the averages. But absent that kind of evidence showing up, history says you're generally safer betting against "late bloomers", as fun as this story is.

While my rational, stat-obsessed side says that you could be right, this is one of those situations where I just don't care. This is way too much fun.

ongbok: The reason why nobody throws it is because it is hard as hell to control and just about everybody that tries to learn it can't control it consistently enough.

I think you're confusing the hard knuckleball with what you've heard about the "conventional" knuckleball. The hard knuckleball does not have the control problems of a flutterball. The problem with the hard knuckler is that at 80mph if it doesn't move enough the pitcher is in serious danger of developing "home run neck". Here's the evidence:

Tim Wakefield, walks per 9 innings, career: 3.4
R.A. Dickey, walks per 9 innings, 2010-2012: 2.2, 2.3, 1.9

For perspective, the league average BB/9 this season is 3.1. Knuckleballers are known for their fair share of walks; Wakefield's above-average rate is the expectation. Dickey is pitching like a control pitcher.

Back to my point: It's not a bad pitch to learn, and has an undeserved stigma because (gasp!) it's a knuckleball. In the 60s some guys named Niekro (and others) helped establish the concept of a "knuckleball pitcher" by turning the flutterball into a career. Prior to that, though, there were few "knuckleballers" because the hard knuckleball was just another pitch. A number of pitchers had it in their repertoire because unlike the flutterball it's not impossible to control. I'm speculating at this point, but I'd say the main reason to avoid learning it is because despite its effectiveness it does take a long time to learn compared to other breaking pitches. Based on an article I read about Dickey it took him about two years (and two awful seasons in Seattle and Minnesota) to perfect. Thing is, I wonder how much of that was because he basically had to re-invent it? Either way, if you told a minor league prospect that there was a pitch that could make him unhittable if he patiently practiced it for two years, I daresay you'd find someone interested in every farm team.

chimp_ninja: He's 37 years old, and has caught fire for a couple months. I hate to say it, but my gut says to trade him while his value is this high. He's not doing anything obviously different. If he had suddenly boosted his velocity or control, I'd say to wait and see.

It's entirely possible that he 'mastered' the pitch this year and is placing it better, disguising it better, studying batters more closely, etc. It's also possible that he has more variation in velocity and break which isn't showing up in the averages. But absent that kind of evidence showing up, history says you're generally safer betting against "late bloomers", as fun as this story is.

Having watched a lot of Dickey this year, the biggest difference is that he seems to have more of a feel for how his knuckleball is going to break. Rather than just toss it up there, he's figured out how to make it break in, out, down, or even in a way that looks like it's breaking up to the hitter. He's got to come down to earth eventually, but there's reason to believe he can be a very very good pitcher for the rest of the year. His past two seasons were pretty solid, too.

chimp_ninja: Prevailing wisdom, which isn't necessarily right, is that part of what makes a knuckleball effective is that there are 1 or 2 guys in all of MLB throwing it at any given time. If lots and lots of guys threw it, batters would bother to take batting practice against it, and eventually it'll get treated like any other ~75mph pitch that is thrown too often.

Anecdotal anecdotes are anecdotal, but I'd never heard that. Even the dumbest HS coach knows that not even the pitcher knows where a flutterball is gonna go, so there's no adjustment to make. When that thing's flying through the air it's basically in God's hands. I was always told that conventional wisdom is you don't practice hitting the knuckler because it'll "mess up your swing for good". The problem is that based on history, learning the knuckleball is aiming for mediocrity. The best use of a conventional knuckleballer (to reiterate, Dickey isn't conventional) is long relief/emergency starter. Most kids don't like to be told their ceiling is 6th starter. Also, having a knuckleball pitcher means you gotta find an excellent defensive catcher and catchers are difficult to find as it is.

chimp_ninja: I think it's hard to disguise with a 'normal' fastball.

You don't disguise your fastball with it. However, hitters adjust to the knuckleball velocity (if not its movement), so Wakefield would rarely throw a "hit it if you see it coming" BP fastball as a sort of "anti-changeup". Even if the arm action screams "fastball", adjusting to a 10+ mph increase in velocity on the fly is tough. I don't know why Dickey would throw a fastball except to really locate a pitch, though -- half the point of the hard knuckler is that it's relatively zippy and he can't throw his heater much faster.

chimp_ninja: It's entirely possible that he 'mastered' the pitch this year and is placing it better, disguising it better, studying batters more closely, etc. It's also possible that he has more variation in velocity and break which isn't showing up in the averages. But absent that kind of evidence showing up, history says you're generally safer betting against "late bloomers", as fun as this story is.

First things first, hitting overall is down. The other thing is that now he's been throwing it semi-effectively for 2+ seasons, the Mets may have scouted their own pitcher. They have enough data to know where hitters are likely to hit it, and can make adjustments that really help him defensively. I daresay he will come down to earth, but I doubt he'll implode either.

Piizzadude: Have they figured out how he is cheating yet? I am guessing sandpaper...

/i keed

You know, I was thinking of how much he reminded me of when Mike Scott suddenly became unhittable back in the '80's.

Boris S. Wort: Piizzadude: Have they figured out how he is cheating yet? I am guessing sandpaper...

/i keed

You know, I was thinking of how much he reminded me of when Mike Scott suddenly became unhittable back in the '80's.

He did the same thing last year, and when I mentioned him in a thread people told me I didn't know what I was talking about and he was a flash in the pan. Last year he should have won 20 games but the Mets bullpen blew so many games where he pitched 7 or 8 innings and turned the game over to them with the lead after giving up no runs or just 1 or two.

chimp_ninja: I hate to say it, but my gut says to trade him while his value is this high.

Absolutely no!. From an economic point of view, the Mets would be foolish to even consider any offers for him. They are paying him 4.35 mill this year, and now are the position that even if they are not in the playoff hunt, at least people will come to the park to watch him pitch and not get stuck with 2/3 of the seats being empty. Also, now you are selling RA Dickey jerseys for $100/pop, and your previously slotted 5th starter can now be you're number 2 starter, and do bullpen duty as well.

And if the Mets do hit the playoffs, Dickey can Pitch on 3 days rest (not sure how hard you want to push Santana in the post season, that no hitter stressed his arm out already)

Funny story about this:

I made this mistake of following Darren Rovell on twitter, and because I follow sports news and marketing, I stupidly keep him in my feed.

Last night, Rovell tried to push the LOLMets agenda by tweeting a picture of "empty" Citifield, under the guise that "MLB says attendance is up, ha ha, they're stupid!"

Two problems with this:

1) The picture was taken at 6:05 EST. A full HOUR before first pitch.

2) Kevin Burkhardt, who works for SNY, and is actually IN the ballpark, started raving about how great the crowd was last night.

Legit 30K at Citi last night, according to him.

The moral of the story: ROvell is a fraud.

Gunderson: And if the Mets do hit the playoffs, Dickey can Pitch on 3 days rest

Not to mention, you can't scout the knuckleball, which is an advantage. Employing a knuckleball pitcher is always a risk because they're notoriously inconsistent, but the thing about "flash in the pan" pitchers is that they take teams by surprise. Either a kid makes the roster as a September call-up with zero scouting info, or a pitcher makes an adjustment that scouts aren't prepared for. That typically lasts less than two months.

At least this "flash in the pan" doesn't risk being figured out. Dickey could wear his tells around his neck with a thousand scouts watching in the stands; if the Mets make the playoffs, the scouting report on him would be laughably simple: "It's a motherfarking knuckleball. You can swing and pray you hit it, or not and pray it misses the strike zone."

Gotta love a guy with a name like R.A. Dickey -- it sounds so old-timey, and he's just killing it this year. Much respect to the man, first time a pitcher has thrown back-to-back 1-hitters in like 25 years or something? CRAZY

So, I'm not a psychologist, but could part of this be attributed to his opening up about his childhood abuse, which simply made him a more confident person?

gtfan92: So, I'm not a psychologist, but could part of this be attributed to his opening up about his childhood abuse, which simply made him a more confident person?

He then climbed Mt. Kilimanjaro for charity, and told the Mets to go fark themselves if they didn't like it. There's definitely a personal growth aspect here.

dragonchild: FreakinB: The crazy thing with Dickey is that he can get his knuckler around 80. People who have seen a lot more baseball than I have keep saying they've never seen anything like it.

It's a "hard knuckleball", which is easier to throw for strikes because it doesn't move as much (not as much time). It was rather common in the 40s but was extinct for decades. I think the only reason why no one else throws it is because high school and college baseball coaches are farking dumbasses who let it go extinct. It's a very effective pitch; I've never seen it but supposedly it breaks like a wobbling forkball.

That's probably the only reason I like baseball anymore. It's the one sport where you can actually succeed with a lost art.


Try telling that to John Fox and the 11-12 Denver Broncos option offense.

dragonchild: I think you're confusing the hard knuckleball with what you've heard about the "conventional" knuckleball. The hard knuckleball does not have the control problems of a flutterball. The problem with the hard knuckler is that at 80mph if it doesn't move enough the pitcher is in serious danger of developing "home run neck". Here's the evidence:

Tim Wakefield, walks per 9 innings, career: 3.4
R.A. Dickey, walks per 9 innings, 2010-2012: 2.2, 2.3, 1.9

For perspective, the league average BB/9 this season is 3.1. Knuckleballers are known for their fair share of walks; Wakefield's above-average rate is the expectation. Dickey is pitching like a control pitcher.

See, but he's throwing the same percentage of pitches (53%) in the strike zone. He's not throwing more strikes-- he's getting batters to chase, and missing more bats in the strike zone as well.

His velocity hasn't changed, and his average break (horizontal or vertical) hasn't changed, so you're down to a few explanations for why Dickey's gone from "good" to "great" at age 37:

1) Dumb luck. Everyone catches fire for a month or two eventually. In related news, I don't think Carlos Ruiz will stay a .354 hitter until October. Hitters are hitting .246 on balls in play vs. him in 2012, vs .291 (career) or .279 (career as kunkcleballer), so that implies at least some luck.
2) More variation. He's getting more movement, but it's equally likely in any direction, so it doesn't pop up in the average.
3) Scouting/mental breakthrough. He's choosing and hitting better locations in and out of the zone.

dragonchild: First things first, hitting overall is down.

NL in 2010: .255/.324/.399
NL in 2011: .253/.319/.391
NL in 2012: .252/.318/.398

I'm not seeing anything that could explain Dickey's sudden rise in 2012.

The other thing is that now he's been throwing it semi-effectively for 2+ seasons, the Mets may have scouted their own pitcher. They have enough data to know where hitters are likely to hit it, and can make adjustments that really help him defensively. I daresay he will come down to earth, but I doubt he'll implode either.

Maybe, although the Mets don't often use an infield shift.

I'm not betting on "implode", by the way. I just think he'll go back to where he was in 2010-2011: A good starting pitcher who could command ~$10-12M/yr for a short-term contract. He's 37, and even Niekro/Wakefield/etc. were declining by that point.

My point is more that if the Mets fall out of contention while this streak is going, they only have to find one GM who thinks it's "the real Dickey" to trade him for a more valuable haul of prospects.

Gunderson: Absolutely no!. From an economic point of view, the Mets would be foolish to even consider any offers for him.

FreakinB: While my rational, stat-obsessed side says that you could be right, this is one of those situations where I just don't care. This is way too much fun.

I agree that the 2010-2011 Jeter Effect may be in play here, where you keep putting him out there because it's what the fans want. However, the fans might also swarm the ballpark in 2013-2015 if you trade him for good prospects. It all depends how long you think this streak will last.

chimp_ninja: 2) More variation. He's getting more movement, but it's equally likely in any direction, so it doesn't pop up in the average.

I know this is pretty much impossible, but it really seems like Dickey's figured out how to get the knuckleball to break in the direction he wants it to break. He also seems to be throwing more first pitch strikes, but I guess he's not throwing more strikes total.

He can't possibly stay this good, but if you watch his games, guys aren't coming close to making solid contact against him. If he keeps throwing the way he has been throwing, he's going to stay very successful. If he loses his touch a bit, he'll regress more. Having watched a whole lot of his starts over the past few seasons, his knuckleball is better now than it was.

Dafatone: He also seems to be throwing more first pitch strikes, but I guess he's not throwing more strikes total.

2010: 59% first-pitch strikes
2011: 63%
2012: 63%

NL average:
2010: 59%
2011: 59%
2012: 60%

Again, no dramatic uptick. Compare that to real control guys like Cliff Lee (72%), Roy Halladay (65%), Jordan Zimmermann (69%), etc. and he doesn't stand out much.

Everything about the guy's raw numbers points towards "good starter", which is why the results seem suspicious to me.

Dafatone: He can't possibly stay this good, but if you watch his games, guys aren't coming close to making solid contact against him. If he keeps throwing the way he has been throwing, he's going to stay very successful. If he loses his touch a bit, he'll regress more. Having watched a whole lot of his starts over the past few seasons, his knuckleball is better now than it was.

Knuckleballs do historically lower batting averages on balls in play. (Typically, this isn't helpful because walks go up and strikeouts go down.) It's entirely possible that he's taken it up a notch in a subtle way, but two months isn't enough time for me to fully buy in. His March/April was ordinary, and his May was excellent. But his season numbers are being skewed by a completely ridiculous June with 34.1 IP in 4 starts, 42:4 K:BB, 68% GB, 13 H (11 singles and 2 doubles), and 0 earned runs.

chimp_ninja: two months isn't enough time for me to fully buy in. His March/April was ordinary, and his May was excellent. But his season numbers are being skewed by a completely ridiculous June with 34.1 IP in 4 starts, 42:4 K:BB, 68% GB, 13 H (11 singles and 2 doubles), and 0 earned runs.

You're making excellent points, BTW. One thing I do remember is that when Wakefield was "on", he was a terror on the mound. He didn't have consecutive one-hitters, but that's a statistical anomaly -- I mean, yeah, you have to be on fire to do that, but unless you get 26Ks a game, at some point it's blind luck. Which is what Wakefield often managed for weeks at a time. He had a 2.81 ERA in 2002 -- pitching in Fenway, no less. It's just that he also had equal moments where he couldn't baffle a Little Leaguer.

So Dickey's run is great, but not particularly shocking. It is hard for a conventional pitcher to suddenly become effective without making changes, but that was never the case with knucklers -- their own inconsistency is typically internal. Hitters fear few things more than a knuckleballer riding a hot streak.

Dafatone: I know this is pretty much impossible, but it really seems like Dickey's figured out how to get the knuckleball to break in the direction he wants it to break. He also seems to be throwing more first pitch strikes, but I guess he's not throwing more strikes total.

I think its more of what I like to call "The Tony Gwynn Phenomena"* . Dickey is becoming more of a media story and more established, so the umpires are more inclined to give him a larger strike zone. With a larger strike zone, more batters are either getting behind in the count, or swinging at more junk

I remember when Tony would bat, and he would never get a 3rd strike called against him. The announcers would just say "Well, Tony has a better eye than the Umps, thats why he gets that call"..

*Of course its reversed in this case with the pitcher get the benefit of the call instead of the batter

Gunderson: Dafatone: I know this is pretty much impossible, but it really seems like Dickey's figured out how to get the knuckleball to break in the direction he wants it to break. He also seems to be throwing more first pitch strikes, but I guess he's not throwing more strikes total.

I think its more of what I like to call "The Tony Gwynn Phenomena"* . Dickey is becoming more of a media story and more established, so the umpires are more inclined to give him a larger strike zone. With a larger strike zone, more batters are either getting behind in the count, or swinging at more junk

I remember when Tony would bat, and he would never get a 3rd strike called against him. The announcers would just say "Well, Tony has a better eye than the Umps, thats why he gets that call"..

*Of course its reversed in this case with the pitcher get the benefit of the call instead of the batter

Dickey definitely got some favorable calls last night. I chalked that up to the umpire having trouble tracking the knuckleball. Also, since it's moving so much when it crosses the plate, it's got a decent shot of nicking some part of the zone.

Are you guys trying to say there is human error and inconsistent strike zones in baseball?!?!?!

I refuse to believe it.

Dafatone: Gunderson: Dafatone: I know this is pretty much impossible, but it really seems like Dickey's figured out how to get the knuckleball to break in the direction he wants it to break. He also seems to be throwing more first pitch strikes, but I guess he's not throwing more strikes total.

I think its more of what I like to call "The Tony Gwynn Phenomena"* . Dickey is becoming more of a media story and more established, so the umpires are more inclined to give him a larger strike zone. With a larger strike zone, more batters are either getting behind in the count, or swinging at more junk

I remember when Tony would bat, and he would never get a 3rd strike called against him. The announcers would just say "Well, Tony has a better eye than the Umps, thats why he gets that call"..

*Of course its reversed in this case with the pitcher get the benefit of the call instead of the batter

Dickey definitely got some favorable calls last night. I chalked that up to the umpire having trouble tracking the knuckleball. Also, since it's moving so much when it crosses the plate, it's got a decent shot of nicking some part of the zone.

I remember in the late 90's when Maddux was at his best, he could get just about any umpire to give him calls 4 inches off the outside corner.

Of course Maddux was insanely smart, too. I remember Eddie Perez (Maddux personal catcher) once told a little anecdote how he was facing Jeff Bagwell late in the season with the Braves winning by a decent clip and the bases empty, it was a pretty neutral count, maybe 2-and-1, and Maddux threw a 2-seamer that he let slip just enough onto the plate for Bagwell to crush it. Perez apparently came out to the mound and asked him what was up with that pitch because Maddux had his typical pinpoint control that day, and Greg told him, "It's for later."

Well, fast forward a month or two to the playoffs, Maddux pitching and Bagwell comes up, this time it's with a runner on first and the Braves are up by 1. Same count, this time Maddux gets the pitch just a few more inches inside and Bagwell, swinging for the fences, instead grounds into a 5-4-3 double play. On the jog into the dugout, Maddux tells Perez, "Remember when you asked why I grooved one to Bagwell a few months ago? That's why."

I'm sure I'm butchering the story, but I think just the premise is pretty darn cool.