not actively seeking such things or strapping a camera phone to my shoe, but if, on the rare occurence, I get a peek, I'm taking it.

In the top illustration, the lady has non-sharp knees and is deemed acceptable.

In the second illustration, the knees are still acceptable and pleasing to the rail riding males.

In the third illustration, the knees are sharp. Hence, she only appeals to those who are slouches and are of bad character.

Forth Illustration: Women with appealing knees can expect to attract wealthy businessmen who will follow them home and offer them gifts or marriage

zarberg: I have no idea if it's true or not, but I've heard that groping got so bad on the subway system in Tokyo that they started putting women's only cars at the ends of the train. From how the story goes, it backfired - guys started assuming that any women not in those cars (which were routinely so full you couldn't get on them) wanted to be groped.

The women only cars are true. Although my understanding is they're only there during high density times. Really that's the worst time for the groping. Since the guys can just play it off like they bumped against you or something. It's rare to see a guy cross a half empty car, sit down beside you, and feel you up.

/of course it is rare to see a half empty car on that system most of the time

CSB:
I'm on the Tokyo subway with a Japanese-American coworker. Guy gropes her. She turns around and slams the heel of her hand right into his nose. He can't really fall down because the car is too packed, but he recoils as much as possible and starts screaming as blood comes out of his nose. She stands there and tells him near perfect Japanese:

"I'm American, you may remember us from the 1940s".

Utter silence on the car after that. Despite the fact it was packed, she somehow got a halo of space around her for the rest of the trip.

Harvey Manfrenjensenjen: Yeah, that's exactly what I'm saying, just like I'm saying it's perfectly OK to steal from someone who has a huge wad of cash in their hand.

Dumbass.

That's sure as sh*t what it sounds like you're saying. So women aren't allowed to wear whatever they want because men can't help themselves? It's not their fault, that f*cking stupid whore was showing too much skin right?

Compassionate Realistic Shanghai subway system tells scantily clad women that if they are harassed it's their own fault

Uchiha_Cycliste: ha-ha-guy: I guess they must all thing I'm the white devil of sexual harassment.

besides accidentally the think ;)
are you the white devil?

I try, I'm more of an imp most days though as opposed to making it up to full on devil.

ha-ha-guy: CSB:I'm on the Tokyo subway with a Japanese-American coworker. Guy gropes her. She turns around and slams the heel of her hand right into his nose. He can't really fall down because the car is too packed, but he recoils as much as possible and starts screaming as blood comes out of his nose. She stands there and tells him near perfect Japanese:"I'm American, you may remember us from the 1940s".

that would be great to see in a movie

SpeedyBB: Jon iz teh kewl: my quesiton is why WOULDNT u want to get molested?
as a guy, the thought of a chick grabbing me on a subway sounds REAL SEXY

Uh, it was a guy fondling you.

Just in case it matters.

way to put woman on a pedestal

cig-mkr: It's the old "The biatches were asking for it" mentality.

Made up fact # 385: "juicy" when read out loud sounds like the phrase for "squeeze me" in something like 18 languages.

Honest Bender: EvilEgg: It's still the perverts fault, but you can try and avoid being their target.

Absolutely, 100%. Yet, somehow you'll still get droves of people biatching you out because you're "blaming the victim." Nevermind the fact that there are often steps the victim could have taken to minimize their risk...

If someone engages in risky behavior, does that make it their fault when something bad happens? In my opinion, partially, yes. Does it make it any less the fault of the attacker? No.

... so you're trying to discourage women from dressing in anything other than a burkha?
I mean, not that there's anything wrong with it, but don't you think that with your apparent interests, you should focus on what men are wearing instead?

Jon iz teh kewl: way to put woman on a pedestal

it's easier to look up skirts and dresses that way

The Taliban would love some of you guys

Tat'dGreaser: The Taliban would love some of you guys

maybe these guys long for the days where a flash of a well turned ankle was enough to get their now rotten dicks hardened without the need of pills

Tat'dGreaser: Harvey Manfrenjensenjen: Yeah, that's exactly what I'm saying, just like I'm saying it's perfectly OK to steal from someone who has a huge wad of cash in their hand.

Dumbass.

That's sure as sh*t what it sounds like you're saying. So women aren't allowed to wear whatever they want because men can't help themselves? It's not their fault, that f*cking stupid whore was showing too much skin right?

Morally, the potential rapist/frotter/groper/starey-guy is in the wrong.

Practically, it is an enforcement problem, and they can minimize it, if they wish.

Jon iz teh kewl: SpeedyBB: Jon iz teh kewl: my quesiton is why WOULDNT u want to get molested?
as a guy, the thought of a chick grabbing me on a subway sounds REAL SEXY

Uh, it was a guy fondling you.

Just in case it matters.

way to put woman on a pedestal

It's much easier to look up their skirts when their are there.

Tat'dGreaser: The Taliban would love some of you guys

But, don't they execute people for that?

Does fapping while staring at them on the subway count as harassment?

Non-verbal communication works both ways.

If you dress like a sex kitten in skimpy clothes you can't complain about the unwelcomed attention.

If you reject the concepts of hygiene you can't complain that you can't get someone's attention.

It's kind of long the lines of: if you don't want people to treat you like a nun, stop dressing like one.

MythDragon: But according to my extensive research, asian woman want to be molested/loved-raped on subways. Thats why they ride them.
[cache.thisorth.at image 320x480]
According to my research.

She's blushing...so she's enjoying it.

loonatic112358: maybe these guys long for the days where a flash of a well turned ankle was enough to get their now rotten dicks hardened without the need of pills

An ankle!?!?! That whore needs to be raped!

lohphat: It's kind of long the lines of: if you don't want people to treat you like a nun, stop dressing like one.

But it's a habit they're in to keeping

I think we have to get over the silly PC taboo about admitting that certain behaviours make you vastly more likely to be a target.

Like riding crowded public transportation with most of your money poking out visibly in plain sight from underneath your clothes.

Or, likewise, riding crowded public transportation with most of your body your body hanging out visibly in plain sight from your clothes.

I don't see why one of those is those truisms is so damn controversial to the wingnuts.

ph0rk: Morally, the potential rapist/frotter/groper/starey-guy is in the wrong.

Practically, it is an enforcement problem, and they can minimize it, if they wish.

They? Who is they? The only people who can minimize this is the people committing the molestation.

The Muthaship: But, don't they execute people for that?

For what?

lohphat: If you dress like a sex kitten in skimpy clothes you can't complain about the unwelcomed attention.

Doesn't that depend on what the "attention" is? Glances, stares, comments, groping, frottage, rape... Unless you're saying that any and all of the above are reasonable. Are you?

Tat'dGreaser: For what?

Loving other guys.

LowbrowDeluxe: Nope, you're still an idiot. There is nothing inherently risky about any of the behavior you're blaming the victim for.

Chinese culture places a low emphasis on women and respect for their space. Like it or not, it is how things roll. The intelligent women (including some of my Asian coworkers) alter their style of dress and the like when in China to avoid being targeted. It's no different than my white ass avoiding the really bad sections of Detroit at 2 am.

Should I have to worry about what streets I turn down in Detroit? No.
Does reality require that I do? Yes.

Same applies to the women. Lashing out at the Shanghai subway system is stupid. The subway system is addressing it in a stupid way, but what is key is the subway system is reacting to cultural trends, not creating them. Targeting the subway system is the wrong place to target. This is much more systemic and likely traces back in part to Confucian views on women and how ingrained they are in society.

/also subway stations are one of the areas to get sex workers in Shanghai, KTV is more common, but still you don't want to get confused with the working girls on the metro

Tat'dGreaser: The Muthaship: But, don't they execute people for that?

For what?

Well, to be fair, they execute people they don't like for pretty much anything.

The Muthaship: Tat'dGreaser: For what?

Loving other guys.

Heh, touche

Honest Bender: EvilEgg: It's still the perverts fault, but you can try and avoid being their target.

Absolutely, 100%. Yet, somehow you'll still get droves of people biatching you out because you're "blaming the victim." Nevermind the fact that there are often steps the victim could have taken to minimize their risk...

If someone engages in risky behavior, does that make it their fault when something bad happens? In my opinion, partially, yes. Does it make it any less the fault of the attacker? No.

Your common sense has no place on the Internet.

FTFA: If the diagram is confusing already with its multiple diagrams, consider the English translation of the explanation:

"If the eyes of the 'observer', i.e. the point E, is right on the extension of segment BC, then point B would fall into his eyesight. Then, let's make another line of DE which goes through E and is perpendicular to the extension of AC, then the right triangle of DEC is similar to the right triangle of ABC. So clearly, the length of DC is the horizontal distance between the man's eye and the lady's skirt. Ladies, have you figured that out?"

TFA seems to fail to take into account that these ladies are Chinese, and probably mathematical wizards.
/ that's wacist

LowbrowDeluxe: Honest Bender: EvilEgg: It's still the perverts fault, but you can try and avoid being their target.

Absolutely, 100%. Yet, somehow you'll still get droves of people biatching you out because you're "blaming the victim." Nevermind the fact that there are often steps the victim could have taken to minimize their risk...

If someone engages in risky behavior, does that make it their fault when something bad happens? In my opinion, partially, yes. Does it make it any less the fault of the attacker? No.

Risky behavior: Jumping off a cliff. Sky diving. Sticking your dick in a plugged in blender. Covering yourself in meat and dancing in front of hungry wildcats who lack the reasoning ability to distinguish your tasty flesh from the tasty meat coating.
Not Risky: Getting dressed in the morning.

Nope, you're still an idiot. There is nothing inherently risky about any of the behavior you're blaming the victim for.

So someone dressed like this...

doesn't attract more negative unwanted attention than someone dressed like this...?


The woman in the first outfit doesn't run a higher risk (riskier) of garnering the attention of unsavory folks?

Exactly the same?

offmymeds: [msnbcmedia.msn.com image 201x600]

"If the eyes of the 'observer', i.e. the point E, is right on the extension of segment BC, then point B would fall into his eyesight. Then, let's make another line of DE which goes through E and is perpendicular to the extension of AC, then the right triangle of DEC is similar to the right triangle of ABC. So clearly, the length of DC is the horizontal distance between the man's eye and the lady's skirt. Ladies, have you figured that out?"

I was told there would be no geometry involved.

The angle of the dangle is proportional to the heat of the meat is all you need to know.

abhorrent1: Does fapping while staring at them on the subway count as harassment?

Only if it doesn't turn into bukkake.

Uisce Beatha: Well, to be fair, they execute people they don't like for pretty much anything.

These guys would love it then. Execute all those sluts that force them to molest them by showing skin. Ugh, it's so gross. Rape and kill them all I say!

The Muthaship: Tat'dGreaser: For what?

Loving other guys.

I take it back - they actually tolerate that. There is a reason the fourth day of the week is called "Man Love Thursday"

Silly Jesus: The woman in the first outfit doesn't run a higher risk (riskier) of garnering the attention of unsavory folks?

I will abstain from that particular debate, but please note that you have embiggened the wrong photograph.

abhorrent1: Does fapping while staring at them on the subway count as harassment?

Counts as "Just an Average Friday Night" to me.

And if you have tattoos and facial piercings it's your own fault for not getting hired for a job. I don't see what the issue here is. It's just the truth. They need to take responsibility for themselves.

Tat'dGreaser: Harvey Manfrenjensenjen: Yeah, that's exactly what I'm saying, just like I'm saying it's perfectly OK to steal from someone who has a huge wad of cash in their hand.

Dumbass.

That's sure as sh*t what it sounds like you're saying. So women aren't allowed to wear whatever they want because men can't help themselves? It's not their fault, that f*cking stupid whore was showing too much skin right?

Exactly- after all, it's women's job to police and control men's behavior. It's not like we can ask fully grown, adult male humans to take responsibilty for their actions. That would be crazy talk!

Theaetetus: lohphat: If you dress like a sex kitten in skimpy clothes you can't complain about the unwelcomed attention.

Doesn't that depend on what the "attention" is? Glances, stares, comments, groping, frottage, rape... Unless you're saying that any and all of the above are reasonable. Are you?

If you can't distinguish between "glances, stares, comments" and "groping, frottage, rape" on the behavioral spectrum then you have other issues.

LowbrowDeluxe: Not Risky: Getting dressed in the morning.

Nope, you're still an idiot. There is nothing inherently risky about any of the behavior you're blaming the victim for.

Here's an example of what I would call risky behavior: Getting blacked out drunk at a frat party. It's risky because it creates a situation where you can very easily be taken advantage of. Does that mean if you're sexually assaulted that it's not the fault of your attacker? Absolutely not. But I think the victim, in this case, shoulders a certain amount of responsibility as well for putting herself in that situation.

Let's go back to the example of clothing. Dressing provocatively, in most situations, isn't very risky behavior. But if you're in a location that has a reputation for fostering molesters (like the subway, apparently) and you choose to dress provocatively, I think you should own some of the blame. It's not your fault you got assaulted. But you did engage in behavior that made it more likely that you would be assaulted.

Now, if you still think my opinion is stupid, I'd love to hear your well thought out reason(s) as to why.

Tat'dGreaser: Uisce Beatha: Well, to be fair, they execute people they don't like for pretty much anything.

These guys would love it then. Execute all those sluts that force them to molest them by showing skin. Ugh, it's so gross. Rape and kill them all I say!

That does sound familiar

/Am I talking about a Fark thread?
//Or Afghanistan?

ha-ha-guy: LowbrowDeluxe: Nope, you're still an idiot. There is nothing inherently risky about any of the behavior you're blaming the victim for.

Chinese culture places a low emphasis on women and respect for their space. Like it or not, it is how things roll. The intelligent women (including some of my Asian coworkers) alter their style of dress and the like when in China to avoid being targeted. It's no different than my white ass avoiding the really bad sections of Detroit at 2 am.

Should I have to worry about what streets I turn down in Detroit? No.
Does reality require that I do? Yes.

Same applies to the women. Lashing out at the Shanghai subway system is stupid. The subway system is addressing it in a stupid way, but what is key is the subway system is reacting to cultural trends, not creating them. Targeting the subway system is the wrong place to target. This is much more systemic and likely traces back in part to Confucian views on women and how ingrained they are in society.

/also subway stations are one of the areas to get sex workers in Shanghai, KTV is more common, but still you don't want to get confused with the working girls on the metro

Are you telling me that American concepts of sex, feminism, and law don't mean much in China?

Silly Jesus: The woman in the first outfit doesn't run a higher risk (riskier) of garnering the attention of unsavory folks?

Exactly the same?

You can look at a woman all you want. It's when it goes farther that we're talking about. Women can walk around butt ass naked if they want, that doesn't give anyone the right to sexually assault them.

Silly Jesus: LowbrowDeluxe: Honest Bender: EvilEgg: It's still the perverts fault, but you can try and avoid being their target.

Absolutely, 100%. Yet, somehow you'll still get droves of people biatching you out because you're "blaming the victim." Nevermind the fact that there are often steps the victim could have taken to minimize their risk...

If someone engages in risky behavior, does that make it their fault when something bad happens? In my opinion, partially, yes. Does it make it any less the fault of the attacker? No.

Risky behavior: Jumping off a cliff. Sky diving. Sticking your dick in a plugged in blender. Covering yourself in meat and dancing in front of hungry wildcats who lack the reasoning ability to distinguish your tasty flesh from the tasty meat coating.
Not Risky: Getting dressed in the morning.

Nope, you're still an idiot. There is nothing inherently risky about any of the behavior you're blaming the victim for.

So someone dressed like this...
[cdnimg.visualizeus.com image 215x184]
doesn't attract more negative unwanted attention than someone dressed like this...?
[www.aaanything.net image 500x501]

The woman in the first outfit doesn't run a higher risk (riskier) of garnering the attention of unsavory folks?

Exactly the same?

chicks on skate boards and girls who sport sturdy shoes are hot.
I'ma chase her down and throw her in my wagon.

ha-ha-guy: Uchiha_Cycliste: ha-ha-guy: I guess they must all thing I'm the white devil of sexual harassment.

besides accidentally the think ;)
are you the white devil?

I try, I'm more of an imp most days though as opposed to making it up to full on devil.

incognito, good thinking. You'll succeed much longer.

For great justice!

Lady Beryl Ersatz-Wendigo: Exactly- after all, it's women's job to police and control men's behavior. It's not like we can ask fully grown, adult male humans to take responsibilty for their actions. That would be crazy talk!

How dare you not dress how I think you should dress!

People should be able to wear anything they want as long as its within decency laws. And If they want to fark you, I think they will let you know. Simple as that. Don't assume anything and you will not get in trouble.

ha-ha-guy:
Utter silence on the car after that. Despite the fact it was packed, she somehow got a halo of space around her for the rest of the trip.

It's funny how the Japanese are trained to show no emotions. I'll bet most of the other passengers were dying laughing inside.