Dafatone: No other sport is like this.

People are trending this way in all sports. It's just that in basketball, people are less accepting of the idea of the team being important, because single players do have more of an impact (except maybe hockey goalies) than anyone else in any sport.

Hell, people act as though some tennis players, like Andy Roddick, sucked because he only won one major and was No. 1 for a shorter time than expected due to lots of hype from a media desperate to have a great American player.

Hardly surprising. Brazil only lost to the US by 2 in the 2010 WC. By far the closest game they played.

/Of course, this US team is better.
//And will get better than they are now by the Olympics.

Wife and I went to the Hoops for Troops event at the DC Armory Saturday to watch them practice. They looked like they had a long way to go. Missed a lot of shots. No surprise the game was so close and not just because international teams are better than they used to be.

/The Asian lady in the dance-off was hot, though.
//She danced like Elaine.

Seeing how Brazil dominated inside last night, just imagine what Robinson and Ewing would do to them! Plus outside shooting was terrible and the Dream Team had dominate perimeter defense.

IAmRight: Dafatone: No other sport is like this.

People are trending this way in all sports. It's just that in basketball, people are less accepting of the idea of the team being important, because single players do have more of an impact (except maybe hockey goalies) than anyone else in any sport.

Hell, people act as though some tennis players, like Andy Roddick, sucked because he only won one major and was No. 1 for a shorter time than expected due to lots of hype from a media desperate to have a great American player.

Good points. I think part of it is just straight racism, though. Goes hand in hand with a lot of other "critiques" of the NBA.

My thought on the whole two teams debate is that there is no way it would be as close as people think. Heck, until the last week of the NBA season there was no way that Team USA would want LeBron out there in the 4th quarter (so old Kobe was defacto leader). Also, if push comes to shove, you are matching up 5 on 5 for the clutch and really the 92 Dream Team dominates the minute Barkley bets Jordan 100,000 dollars that he can't drop 65 points in regulation.

1992 rules: New dream team flops, gets no calls and all 92 does is shoot layups at the other end while 2012 yells at the refs
2012 rules: Jordan drives to the lane so much that he might end up with 35 "and 1s." If he's pissed off and being an asshole, it could get to point that if you think we biatch about the Heat shooting foul shots, imagine him at the line more than Wilt in the 100 pt game (and at that age, he was hitting his competetive peak).

I'd pray for 1992 rules because the 2012 game would just be downright BORING FT shooting contest

bigbadideasinaction:

I'm still of the sneaking suspicion that the Raptors get a lot of quiet calls from agents saying "if you draft our kid, that cool northern air's gonna make his knees hurt until he moves south". It would explain why they keep drafting from afar (where Toronto isn't as scary a city to a European) or much worse than projected.

That or their management just sucks that much, take your pick.

It's most likely the former and honestly I don't get it. It's not like these guys aren't living in igloos, cripes there are three giant, modern condo highrises a block from the ACC and all player/staff parking is underground. There seems to be a stigma about Toronto that it's not in tune with the "urban" crowd(thank you very much Vince Carter) which is laughable since damn near every NBA player actively avoids living in the "old neighborhood" and move to the 'burbs at the first opportunity.

you have pee hands: Jim from Saint Paul: Practice?

These are franchise players we're talking about.

They're Men! Kobe's 40!

Flappyhead: There seems to be a stigma about Toronto that it's not in tune with the "urban" crowd

I think that's code for "it's Canadian".

TheManofPA: Heck, until the last week of the NBA season there was no way that Team USA would want LeBron out there in the 4th quarter (so old Kobe was defacto leader)

He'd have been out there. You've got to remember that the people running team USA are not, in fact, WIP callers.

torr5962: Spain is going to give this team fits. Their big men are gonna have some issues getting out and guarding other big guys with 20 foot range.

I wanna see some Rubio revenge when these two teams match up.
/wolves fan

you have pee hands: TheManofPA: Heck, until the last week of the NBA season there was no way that Team USA would want LeBron out there in the 4th quarter (so old Kobe was defacto leader)

He'd have been out there. You've got to remember that the people running team USA are not, in fact, WIP callers.

I just meant until this year's finals he'd be pulled because he was "considered" to be the big choke artist (right or wrong based on previous performance). Not anymore though, that was stricken off the record after this year's finals just like Dirk in 11.

Can anyone think of someone considered to choke in the clutch to win in 13?

TheManofPA: you have pee hands: TheManofPA: Heck, until the last week of the NBA season there was no way that Team USA would want LeBron out there in the 4th quarter (so old Kobe was defacto leader)

He'd have been out there. You've got to remember that the people running team USA are not, in fact, WIP callers.

I just meant until this year's finals he'd be pulled because he was "considered" to be the big choke artist (right or wrong based on previous performance). Not anymore though, that was stricken off the record after this year's finals just like Dirk in 11.

Can anyone think of someone considered to choke in the clutch to win in 13?

See, what's dumb is, if the Thunder had won, everyone would still consider Lebron a choker despite him singlehandedly winning game 6 @Boston. Now sure, he hasn't come up big in big spots before. But he also HAS come up big in big spots. Kind of like everyone.

/Wasn't there a shoe or Gatorade or something commercial that was a compilation of every time MJ missed a game winner?

IAmRight: fo_sho!: I know it won't happen, but god I hope that this team comes home with something other than gold.

Why?

Because I would get a certain smug schadenfreude from seeing a bunch of shoot first millionaires lose to some sound fundamentals, jump shooting taxi drivers.

/Yes I know most teams field pros

Dafatone: See, what's dumb is, if the Thunder had won, everyone would still consider Lebron a choker despite him singlehandedly winning game 6 @Boston.

Well duh, if he choked vs OKC then Boston wouldn't matter, but he didn't, so this whole argument doesn't matter.

/still got schooled by Dallas

fo_sho!: Because I would get a certain smug schadenfreude from seeing a bunch of shoot first millionaires lose to some sound fundamentals, jump shooting taxi drivers.

So because you're a racist and/or idiot. Got it.

TheManofPA: Can anyone think of someone considered to choke in the clutch to win in 13?

Well, Durant is considered clutch despite not having won anything. Maybe we can do what we did with LeBron and Dirk and ignore the times they did come through and pretend they never happened, then claim because he lost in the Finals that he's a choker.

TheManofPA: I just meant until this year's finals he'd be pulled because he was "considered" to be the big choke artist (right or wrong based on previous performance). Not anymore though, that was stricken off the record after this year's finals just like Dirk in 11.

Can anyone think of someone considered to choke in the clutch to win in 13?

And I'm saying he wouldn't have been pulled because the team is run by professional coaches who know to put their best 5 on the floor at the end of the game rather than worrying about Grit!! and Clutch!!!

IAmRight: Well, Durant is considered clutch despite not having won anything. Maybe we can do what we did with LeBron and Dirk and ignore the times they did come through and pretend they never happened, then claim because he lost in the Finals that he's a choker.

Oh my God dude, get the fark over it already, it's over.

TheJoe03: Dafatone: See, what's dumb is, if the Thunder had won, everyone would still consider Lebron a choker despite him singlehandedly winning game 6 @Boston.

Well duh, if he choked vs OKC then Boston wouldn't matter, but he didn't, so this whole argument doesn't matter.

/still got schooled by Dallas

Yeah, and Dallas got knocked out in what, the first round this year?

Sometimes teams beat other teams. Only in the NBA is it "omg they suck for losing" every time, rather than "hey, this team beat that team."

Dafatone: Sometimes teams beat other teams. Only in the NBA is it "omg they suck for losing" every time, rather than "hey, this team beat that team."

It happens in the NFL a lot too. You could find people calling Peyton was a loser for a long time even if 29 teams would have taken him in a heartbeat.

Dafatone: Yeah, and Dallas got knocked out in what, the first round this year?

Someone doesn't pay attention to the offseason. Also, are you really trying to take away beating the Heat when they had LeBron from us long suffering Mavericks fans? Pretty dick move.

/Dirk, Marion, and Terry all made LeBron look bad that series, it was my favorite sports experience I can remember.

TheJoe03: Dafatone: Yeah, and Dallas got knocked out in what, the first round this year?

Someone doesn't pay attention to the offseason. Also, are you really trying to take away beating the Heat when they had LeBron from us long suffering Mavericks fans? Pretty dick move.

/Dirk, Marion, and Terry all made LeBron look bad that series, it was my favorite sports experience I can remember.

I'm just saying teams win sometimes.

The Mavs had a great team, Dirk went absolutely crazy, and they won a championship. All the talk that LeBron choked is what takes away from the Mavs. The story isn't that LeBron choked, it's that Dirk went insane and the Mavs won.

KnowEyeInnTeem: Wife and I went to the Hoops for Troops event at the DC Armory Saturday to watch them practice. They looked like they had a long way to go. Missed a lot of shots.

We're talking about practice.

Dafatone: All the talk that LeBron choked is what takes away from the Mavs. The story isn't that LeBron choked, it's that Dirk went insane and the Mavs won.

I'm not arguing about anything, I'm being a fan that likes to throw that in the face of Heat fans. That said, sure it took away from the Mavs, but the media would have done that no matter what. We swept the Lakers and the media only talked about the Lakers losing instead of the Mavs winning. Not a big deal for me. I also think LeBron "choked" because of the way Dallas played him and gave him no respect. We punked him and it was funny. The zone and the trash talk f'ed his game up and is why people say he choked. Marion calling him a biatch, Terry calling out LeBron and then backing it up, Dirk saying he was classless while outplaying him. Best thing ever.

thisisyourbrainonFark: KnowEyeInnTeem: Wife and I went to the Hoops for Troops event at the DC Armory Saturday to watch them practice. They looked like they had a long way to go. Missed a lot of shots.

We're talking about practice.

Not a game.

/2nd Iverson rap reference this thread
//*approves*

IAmRight: People are trending this way in all sports. It's just that in basketball, people are less accepting of the idea of the team being important, because single players do have more of an impact (except maybe hockey goalies) than anyone else in any sport.

This has been my observation as well. I just blank that part of sports conversation out, because it's stupid.

ShadezofDis: This has been my observation as well. I just blank that part of sports conversation out, because it's stupid.

Same thing with the "modern NBA players don't play defense!", it's totally wrong but accepted as fact by many sports fans.

IAmRight: Well, Durant is considered clutch despite not having won anything.

Well, he sort of carried the 2010 World Championships team. Him and Iguodala, really.

TheJoe03: ShadezofDis: This has been my observation as well. I just blank that part of sports conversation out, because it's stupid.

Same thing with the "modern NBA players don't play defense!", it's totally wrong but accepted as fact by many sports fans.

What's hilarious about that line is older NBA players didn't play defense a lot of the time. Actually playing defense is one of the things that made Bill Russell stand out back in the 60s.

Amazed how few Farkers got the Brazilian Blow Out reference.

I don't think winning by double digits is almost being blown out...

rka: What does that even mean?

It means don't open your mouth and say retarded shiat. It will come back to bite you in the end.

TheJoe03: IAmRight: Well, Durant is considered clutch despite not having won anything. Maybe we can do what we did with LeBron and Dirk and ignore the times they did come through and pretend they never happened, then claim because he lost in the Finals that he's a choker.

Oh my God dude, get the fark over it already, it's over.

Sorry, but If you disagree with him you are a racist.

Ten points isn't a blow-out, subby. If you can't come back from 10 points down at the half, you don't deserve to play on an Olympic team.

IAmRight: Well, Durant is considered clutch despite not having won anything. Maybe we can do what we did with LeBron and Dirk and ignore the times they did come through and pretend they never happened, then claim because he lost in the Finals that he's a choker.

Durant has fewer years in the league. If he hasn't won by the time he's Lebron's age, you probably will hear that.

pion: IAmRight: Well, Durant is considered clutch despite not having won anything. Maybe we can do what we did with LeBron and Dirk and ignore the times they did come through and pretend they never happened, then claim because he lost in the Finals that he's a choker.

Durant has fewer years in the league. If he hasn't won by the time he's Lebron's age, you probably will hear that.

Doubtful.





/I don't hate the guy, think he's clearly the best in the game. But I can see why many hate him.

Dafatone: They wouldn't have come close. Stephon Marbury is bad at basketball. Having him on the floor makes your team worse than not having him on the floor.

He always reminded me of a player that thinks he so good at lower levels that he never has to practice or play as a team to win, if he would have had discipline to wait for plays to develop instead of the "F*ck it, Imma do it myself" attitude they he may have been good.

IAmRight: Dafatone: No other sport is like this.

People are trending this way in all sports. It's just that in basketball, people are less accepting of the idea of the team being important, because single players do have more of an impact (except maybe hockey goalies) than anyone else in any sport.

Hell, people act as though some tennis players, like Andy Roddick, sucked because he only won one major and was No. 1 for a shorter time than expected due to lots of hype from a media desperate to have a great American player.

The trend is largely media-driven, because it drives ratings. It's gotten more traction with the NBA because of the way the league markets itself. Of the North American sports leagues, none of them place as heavy an emphasis on the individual players as the NBA does. It's a star-driven league, and when you add in the healthy dose of racism, it's no surprise that NBA players are judged more harshly.

UNC_Samurai: IAmRight: Dafatone: No other sport is like this.

People are trending this way in all sports. It's just that in basketball, people are less accepting of the idea of the team being important, because single players do have more of an impact (except maybe hockey goalies) than anyone else in any sport.

Hell, people act as though some tennis players, like Andy Roddick, sucked because he only won one major and was No. 1 for a shorter time than expected due to lots of hype from a media desperate to have a great American player.

The trend is largely media-driven, because it drives ratings. It's gotten more traction with the NBA because of the way the league markets itself. Of the North American sports leagues, none of them place as heavy an emphasis on the individual players as the NBA does. It's a star-driven league, and when you add in the healthy dose of racism, it's no surprise that NBA players are judged more harshly.

yep espn has to have something for the talking heads and screaming idiots to "debate" 24 hours a day...

A Fark Handle: UNC_Samurai: IAmRight: Dafatone: No other sport is like this.

People are trending this way in all sports. It's just that in basketball, people are less accepting of the idea of the team being important, because single players do have more of an impact (except maybe hockey goalies) than anyone else in any sport.

Hell, people act as though some tennis players, like Andy Roddick, sucked because he only won one major and was No. 1 for a shorter time than expected due to lots of hype from a media desperate to have a great American player.

The trend is largely media-driven, because it drives ratings. It's gotten more traction with the NBA because of the way the league markets itself. Of the North American sports leagues, none of them place as heavy an emphasis on the individual players as the NBA does. It's a star-driven league, and when you add in the healthy dose of racism, it's no surprise that NBA players are judged more harshly.

yep espn has to have something for the talking heads and screaming idiots to "debate" 24 hours a day...

Paging Mr. Bayless and Mr. A. Smith to the thread please.

TheManofPA: A Fark Handle: UNC_Samurai: IAmRight: Dafatone: No other sport is like this.

People are trending this way in all sports. It's just that in basketball, people are less accepting of the idea of the team being important, because single players do have more of an impact (except maybe hockey goalies) than anyone else in any sport.

Hell, people act as though some tennis players, like Andy Roddick, sucked because he only won one major and was No. 1 for a shorter time than expected due to lots of hype from a media desperate to have a great American player.

The trend is largely media-driven, because it drives ratings. It's gotten more traction with the NBA because of the way the league markets itself. Of the North American sports leagues, none of them place as heavy an emphasis on the individual players as the NBA does. It's a star-driven league, and when you add in the healthy dose of racism, it's no surprise that NBA players are judged more harshly.

yep espn has to have something for the talking heads and screaming idiots to "debate" 24 hours a day...

Paging Mr. Bayless and Mr. A. Smith to the thread please.

On a related note, isn't this part of the reason Bob Ryan wants to retire?

IAmRight: Hell, people act as though some tennis players, like Andy Roddick, sucked because he only won one major and was No. 1 for a shorter time than expected due to lots of hype from a media desperate to have a great American player.

Man, Roddick really must be one of the most underrated players. People definitely act like he was some shiatty player who just got lucky once. In addition to winning a slam, which few players do obviously, he was runner-up FOUR times (losing all four to greatest of all time Roger Federer) and made the semis another 5 times, losing most to Fed too I think.

He also made finals of master series 9 times, winning 5.

1 slam, 4 runner-ups, and 5 master series titles should be a great career objectively speaking. he came SUPER close to winning a second one against Federer in the 09 5 setter.

Don't talk about...matching up against the 1992 Dream Team? You kidding me? Matching up against the 1992 Dream Team? I just hope we can avoid being blown out by Brazil!

UNC_Samurai: The trend is largely media-driven, because it drives ratings.

Partly. Yes it is true that sports "journalism" is an out and out embarrassment these days. Horrid. There is more integrity and honor amongst the people that write for the High Society and Debutante Beat. The Jay Marriotti's and the Skip Bayless's of the world are a drain on good discussion.

But it's also that there are a million outlets like this sports tab or moronic call-in radio shows that allow idiots like "Vic in NoCal" to spout stupid opinions.

People are stupid. We just have a lot more ways to hear them these days.

rka: NoCal

I hate when people say NoCal, it's NoRCal.

Bill Frist: IAmRight: Hell, people act as though some tennis players, like Andy Roddick, sucked because he only won one major and was No. 1 for a shorter time than expected due to lots of hype from a media desperate to have a great American player.

Man, Roddick really must be one of the most underrated players. People definitely act like he was some shiatty player who just got lucky once. In addition to winning a slam, which few players do obviously, he was runner-up FOUR times (losing all four to greatest of all time Roger Federer) and made the semis another 5 times, losing most to Fed too I think.

He also made finals of master series 9 times, winning 5.

1 slam, 4 runner-ups, and 5 master series titles should be a great career objectively speaking. he came SUPER close to winning a second one against Federer in the 09 5 setter.

He married Brooklyn Decker. His career is allowed to be torn to shreds if only to allow the common man something against him

It's shocking to think that Dream Team of 92's worst player still had a 13 season long NBA carrer.

TheJoe03: rka: NoCal

I hate when people say NoCal, it's NoRCal.

I doubt they care.

UNC_Samurai: IAmRight: Dafatone: No other sport is like this.

People are trending this way in all sports. It's just that in basketball, people are less accepting of the idea of the team being important, because single players do have more of an impact (except maybe hockey goalies) than anyone else in any sport.

Hell, people act as though some tennis players, like Andy Roddick, sucked because he only won one major and was No. 1 for a shorter time than expected due to lots of hype from a media desperate to have a great American player.

The trend is largely media-driven, because it drives ratings. It's gotten more traction with the NBA because of the way the league markets itself. Of the North American sports leagues, none of them place as heavy an emphasis on the individual players as the NBA does. It's a star-driven league, and when you add in the healthy dose of racism, it's no surprise that NBA players are judged more harshly.

The shocking thing is Gary Bettman wants a more NBA-like NHL (his original job was with the NBA before he became the NHL Commish).

He wanted a league where they promoted a few superstars - Crosby, Ovetchkin, Lunquivst, Thomas, Kane - above all else. Those matchups mattered, not the teams. It didn't even seem ot matter that several of that list spoke neither French nor English, and it left out huge, storied franches in Montreal, Toronto, and his pet projects in the south like Nashville and San Jose.

In a game like Basketball, it works - one player having an exceptional game can truly rise a team to a win in a big game. Lebron scores 30 points it's gonna be weird if they don't win. Not so in Hockey. Even goalies - Hendrik Lunquvist can have a stand-on-his-head performance and still lose in a wonky puck in overtime (see game 6 of the ECF this year).

So what I'm saying: Bettman is an asshole. But I take most opportunities to say that even if its completely unrelated.