Not sure what else he can do at this point. It seems to be working on the simpler sorts of people, too.

They do so at their own peril. Define your policies, or have your opponents define them for you.

They're trying to capitalize on the "Not Obama" message. Ha. Unfortunately for them - Romney is actually incredibly unlikeable which allows Obama to capitalize on the "Not Romney" message.

So, the Romney campaign?

St_Francis_P: Not sure what else he can do at this point. It seems to be working on the simpler sorts of people, too.

But not enough to move the polls very much.

Obama, Clinton, Romney or Ryan.

Who you going to have a beer with?

For my suds money, it's going to have to be Hilary. She probably has the best stories.

Can we turn the paste into biodiesel and solve two problems at once?

Aarontology: Can we turn the paste into biodiesel and solve two problems at once?

Can we turn Paul Ryan into biodiesel paste and use it to power Sarah Palin's snowmobile that she uses to hunt polar bears and pussy libruls and send her off to the north pole and get rid of the two worst VP picks in my living memory in one stroke?

Aarontology: Can we turn the paste into biodiesel and solve two problems at once?

Soylent Green is people!

Bontesla: They're trying to capitalize on the "Not Obama" message. Ha. Unfortunately for them - Romney is actually incredibly unlikeable which allows Obama to capitalize on the "Not Romney" message.

The difference being that Obama can run on the 'ended operations in Iraq', 'killed bin Laden', 'gave businesses incentives to hire veterans', 'credit card reform', and 'ended DADT' message.

Meanwhile, Romney runs on the 'I made a lot of money' message.

cameroncrazy1984: St_Francis_P: Not sure what else he can do at this point. It seems to be working on the simpler sorts of people, too.

But not enough to move the polls very much.

Yeah, but when Adlai Stevenson ran for President and reporter told him 'Mr. Stevenson, you have the vote of every thinking American.' His response was a classic: 'That's fine, but I need a majority to win.'

baronbloodbath: Aarontology: Can we turn the paste into biodiesel and solve two problems at once?

Soylent Green is people!

Soylent Green is corporations, my friend!

Notabunny: baronbloodbath: Aarontology: Can we turn the paste into biodiesel and solve two problems at once?

Soylent Green is people!

Soylent Green is corporations, my friend!

Soylent Green, Wet. Good.

The Lone Gunman: Bontesla: They're trying to capitalize on the "Not Obama" message. Ha. Unfortunately for them - Romney is actually incredibly unlikeable which allows Obama to capitalize on the "Not Romney" message.

The difference being that Obama can run on the 'ended operations in Iraq', 'killed bin Laden', 'gave businesses incentives to hire veterans', 'credit card reform', and 'ended DADT' message.

Meanwhile, Romney runs on the 'I made a lot of money' message.

He runs on the "I DESERVE to be President, and fark you poors for asking why."

LordJiro: The Lone Gunman: Bontesla: They're trying to capitalize on the "Not Obama" message. Ha. Unfortunately for them - Romney is actually incredibly unlikeable which allows Obama to capitalize on the "Not Romney" message.

The difference being that Obama can run on the 'ended operations in Iraq', 'killed bin Laden', 'gave businesses incentives to hire veterans', 'credit card reform', and 'ended DADT' message.

Meanwhile, Romney runs on the 'I made a lot of money' message.

He runs on the "I DESERVE to be President, and fark you poors for asking why."

...platform.

Ok, so my mom's husband's mom is 90 and had a cow valve put into her heart, courtesy of the VA, about ten years ago. It's reaching the end of its life and she is too old/overweight to undergo another surgery and is showing signs of congestive heart failure. She has recently had to give up living on her own and has moved to a nursing home.

In order to afford this nursing home, she needed to apply for one of the Medicaid spots and liquidate enough of her assets (give up her social security check, etc.) to qualify. I don't think it was a great deal, as she really didn't have much to begin with. This nursing home -- out-of-pocket -- is something like $4,000 a month. No way could she do it otherwise, and I don't think the VA offers long-term care anymore.

Anyway, if the Ryan plan were in effect today, what would happen? Would she just get an $8,000 voucher and be told, "Good luck!"? That would be two months and she'd literally be out on the street. Is his plan truly this horrible -- because that's just sick.

Feed the old people to the poor people! It's brilliant!

And we can have a reality show where we push an old lady into an arena full of starving children. Ratings gold!

Vouchers! It's so brilliant old people won't know how to use them! We'll never have to pay for them. Their feeble decrepit minds can't handle change. I can't stop laughing. I love being a conservative.

The Lone Gunman: Bontesla: They're trying to capitalize on the "Not Obama" message. Ha. Unfortunately for them - Romney is actually incredibly unlikeable which allows Obama to capitalize on the "Not Romney" message.

The difference being that Obama can run on the 'ended operations in Iraq', 'killed bin Laden', 'gave businesses incentives to hire veterans', 'credit card reform', and 'ended DADT' message.

Meanwhile, Romney runs on the 'I made a lot of money' message.

Yeah. In this, "Not x" strategy, President Obama is the winner. At least . . . let's hope?

So liberals are going with the retard stance. The latest wyden/Ryan plan states as one of the options as utilizing Medicare as currently provided. This is for all age groups. Apparently subtard is doubling down on ignorance.

Has the left yet admitted that growth cuts can't pay for both Aca and Medicare trust yet?

St_Francis_P: Not sure what else he can do at this point. It seems to be working on the simpler sorts of people, too.

b0rg9: Ok, so my mom's husband's mom is 90 and had a cow valve put into her heart, courtesy of the VA, about ten years ago. It's reaching the end of its life and she is too old/overweight to undergo another surgery and is showing signs of congestive heart failure. She has recently had to give up living on her own and has moved to a nursing home.

In order to afford this nursing home, she needed to apply for one of the Medicaid spots and liquidate enough of her assets (give up her social security check, etc.) to qualify. I don't think it was a great deal, as she really didn't have much to begin with. This nursing home -- out-of-pocket -- is something like $4,000 a month. No way could she do it otherwise, and I don't think the VA offers long-term care anymore.

Anyway, if the Ryan plan were in effect today, what would happen? Would she just get an $8,000 voucher and be told, "Good luck!"? That would be two months and she'd literally be out on the street. Is his plan truly this horrible -- because that's just sick.

The Ryan plan is designed only affect Medicare for people under 55- i.e., Medicare won't change if you're old and likely to vote Republican.

Obama plans to cut both medicare and tricare benefits. Let's discuss that.

Bontesla: They're trying to capitalize on the "Not Obama" message. Ha. Unfortunately for them - Romney is actually incredibly unlikeable which allows Obama to capitalize on the "Not Romney" message.

When I was taking a cab up to the local Democratic Campaign office, my driver heard the address I was going to and said "I'm guessing that you are going to go get a ticket to see our "Illustrious Leader", right?"

Not wanting to have an "All In The Family" scale argument with this neo-Archie Bunker during the ride (I'm willing to accept the idea of conservatives out there, so long as they are tenpoundsofcheese stupid obnoxious about it), I just simply said yeah and explained that I was on the fence about it, but having Romney picking Ryan tipped the scales for me.

He confessed that he was a conservative (WHAT? NO WAI!!!!) and worries that Obama was going to come take his guns, but even he had to admit that he's not sure he could vote for Romney/Ryan because those two guys were just a bit too skeevy for even this gun guy's tastes.

IMO, it's not a negative campaign against Romney/Ryan if these two jackwagons really ARE brimming with nothing but the promise of injustice, crushing poverty, and death for the majority of Americans. It's called "getting the word out".

I still don't understand it. If Romney wanted to continue to run on vague opaque rhetoric he could have picked one of the other 'boring old white guys'. They could have run around the country screaming 'Obama bad! Romney good!' just as effectively as Ryan.

The problem is that Ryan is known for one thing and one thing alone - his budget plan which contains a whole lot of specific details (at least relative to Romney's budget plans). Ryan can't run around the country and just spout generic anti-Obama rhetoric - he has to play defense at the same time (which is why you see these medicare lies getting repeated nonstop).

We all laughed at McCain's performance in 08 but honestly Romney is making him look like a tactical genius in comparison. The election still might swing either way but if Romney was running a buttoned-down, competent, methodical campaign this would be a blowout. The guy has unlimited superpac money, blatantly partisan attempts at voter screening, enormous lingering unemployment and economic suffering working in his favor and he's down by a handful?  A cinderblock with the GOP logo painted on it could sway more independent voters. It'd probably be more charismatic as well.

b0rg9: Ok, so my mom's husband's mom is 90 and had a cow valve put into her heart, courtesy of the VA, about ten years ago. It's reaching the end of its life and she is too old/overweight to undergo another surgery and is showing signs of congestive heart failure. She has recently had to give up living on her own and has moved to a nursing home.

In order to afford this nursing home, she needed to apply for one of the Medicaid spots and liquidate enough of her assets (give up her social security check, etc.) to qualify. I don't think it was a great deal, as she really didn't have much to begin with. This nursing home -- out-of-pocket -- is something like $4,000 a month. No way could she do it otherwise, and I don't think the VA offers long-term care anymore.

Anyway, if the Ryan plan were in effect today, what would happen? Would she just get an $8,000 voucher and be told, "Good luck!"? That would be two months and she'd literally be out on the street. Is his plan truly this horrible -- because that's just sick.

Well, she would get a voucher to purchase Medicare insurance, but Medicare doesn't pay for nursing homes. Medicaid does, as you've discovered.

Ryan's plan would give federal block grants to the States, reducing the federal expenditure on Medicaid by $810 billion over 10 years. States would get greater latitude to set their own Medicaid eligibility benefits policies. Here is a PBS primer on Ryan's Medicaid plan: Link

Thanks for the link, BarkingUnicorn!

Bontesla: They're trying to capitalize on the "Not Obama" message. Ha. Unfortunately for them - Romney is actually incredibly unlikeable which allows Obama to capitalize on the "Not Romney" message.

I dunno, I'm not fully convinced that Romney is not Obama. I'm an undecided voter and this is an important issue to me. I think another month of advertising by the Romney campaign would help me understand if Romney is or is not Obama.

Sadly he doesn't have to talk about his policy plans as long as he can count on the large "OMG, the Kenyan in the WH is secretly a muslim terrorist who wants to take away our guns and destroy America!" derp brigade vote.

LarryDan43: Vouchers! It's so brilliant old people won't know how to use them! We'll never have to pay for them. Their feeble decrepit minds can't handle change. I can't stop laughing. I love being a conservative.

I had some elderly relatives. Before their recent deaths near 90 years old they had a (government?) worker assigned to them to help them figure out medicare/medicaid. They weren't senile but navigating the rules can be confusing. I can imagine how much more confusing it will become particularly with the added complication of having to find a private adviser to help telderly make their decisions.

HairBolus: LarryDan43: Vouchers! It's so brilliant old people won't know how to use them! We'll never have to pay for them. Their feeble decrepit minds can't handle change. I can't stop laughing. I love being a conservative.

I had some elderly relatives. Before their recent deaths near 90 years old they had a (government?) worker assigned to them to help them figure out medicare/medicaid. They weren't senile but navigating the rules can be confusing. I can imagine how much more confusing it will become particularly with the added complication of having to find a private adviser to help telderly make their decisions.

I'm sure a private advisor would only tell them things in their best interests. I mean if you can't trust big for profit health care corporations, who can you trust. Honestly.

fatandolder: Obama plans to cut both medicare and tricare benefits. Let's discuss that.

There are no medicare cuts proposed by Obama. As for TriCare, it's socialized health care insurance. If you don't like the necessary increase, feel free to get private insurance in the free market, commie.

BarkingUnicorn: Well, she would get a voucher to purchase Medicare insurance, but Medicare doesn't pay for nursing homes. Medicaid does, as you've discovered.

Ryan's plan would give federal block grants to the States, reducing the federal expenditure on Medicaid by $810 billion over 10 years. States would get greater latitude to set their own Medicaid eligibility benefits policies.


I can only imagine how Florida governor, Rick Scott, would handle Medicare if greater latitude were left in his hands.

want to see what refusing the medicaid expansion looks like? there is a huge amount of new building going on in the university/medical section of downtown. new orleans is still trying to recover back to where they were pre katrina. at the same time the f-ing tea party folks have gutted revenues so not only are many of these projects now not looking good but other older existing projects are getting cut.

like the southeast louisiana hospital getting closed. bobby pissed off a bunch of folks with this one.

BarkingUnicorn: Ryan's plan would give federal block grants to the States, reducing the federal expenditure on Medicaid by $810 billion over 10 years. States would get greater latitude to set their own Medicaid eligibility benefits policies. Here is a PBS primer on Ryan's Medicaid plan: Link

So, in short, the block grant is indexed to inflation and population growth, not to the actual cost increase of healthcare. That's horrifying.

The "States would have more flexibility over who is covered and what benefits are offered" part translates to "We're going to allow states to deny whomever they want these benefits without recourse."

Repealing the Medicaid expansion means tons of people (11 million, according to your link) would be ineligible for aid they need. Anyone who is anywhere near the poverty line needs this aid.

And according to your link, his proposals would kick anywhere from 14 to 38 million people off of Medicaid. 14 to 38 million people. What, praytell, do these people then do?

Doc Lee: fatandolder: Obama plans to cut both medicare and tricare benefits. Let's discuss that.

There are no medicare cuts proposed by Obama. As for TriCare, it's socialized health care insurance. If you don't like the necessary increase, feel free to get private insurance in the free market, commie.

It is part of a contact, socialized or not. The contract was we served 20 or more years in the military, when they had to draft people, we were to have medical care for life. No co pay was involved. Like always when the government is done with you, you get screwed, and the people of this country help screw you.

Rand Paul Ryan.

b0rg9: Anyway, if the Ryan plan were in effect today, what would happen? Would she just get an $8,000 voucher and be told, "Good luck!"? That would be two months and she'd literally be out on the street. Is his plan truly this horrible -- because that's just sick.

Yes. That is, assuming Medicare chose to cover her in the first place, which states would be able to determine on their own. Primer: How Paul Ryan's Plan Would Change Medicaid

"I'm having a heart attack"

"I'll drive you to the hospital"

"Nono, wait until you have one. I have a two for one coupon."

The Lone Gunman: Bontesla: They're trying to capitalize on the "Not Obama" message. Ha. Unfortunately for them - Romney is actually incredibly unlikeable which allows Obama to capitalize on the "Not Romney" message.

The difference being that Obama can run on the 'ended operations in Iraq', 'killed bin Laden', 'gave businesses incentives to hire veterans', 'credit card reform', and 'ended DADT' message.

Meanwhile, Romney runs on the 'I made a lot of money' message.

Hope you don't mind, I just stole that post to slam some relatives...

The Lone Gunman: Bontesla: They're trying to capitalize on the "Not Obama" message. Ha. Unfortunately for them - Romney is actually incredibly unlikeable which allows Obama to capitalize on the "Not Romney" message.

The difference being that Obama can run on the 'ended operations in Iraq', 'killed bin Laden', 'gave businesses incentives to hire veterans', 'credit card reform', and 'ended DADT' message.

Meanwhile, Romney runs on the 'I made a lot of money' message.

Of course gitmo is still open, we're still in Afghanistan, we're another 4 trill deeper in debt as well. I bet you weren't gonna mention those parts were you?

Medicare is unsustainable. It cannot be fixed. If we don't end it, it will bankrupt the country. IOW, it will bankrupt the country. Enjoy your second-world status, gen-xers.

b0rg9: Ok, so my mom's husband's mom is 90 and had a cow valve put into her heart, courtesy of the VA, about ten years ago. It's reaching the end of its life and she is too old/overweight to undergo another surgery and is showing signs of congestive heart failure. She has recently had to give up living on her own and has moved to a nursing home.

In order to afford this nursing home, she needed to apply for one of the Medicaid spots and liquidate enough of her assets (give up her social security check, etc.) to qualify. I don't think it was a great deal, as she really didn't have much to begin with. This nursing home -- out-of-pocket -- is something like $4,000 a month. No way could she do it otherwise, and I don't think the VA offers long-term care anymore.

Anyway, if the Ryan plan were in effect today, what would happen? Would she just get an $8,000 voucher and be told, "Good luck!"? That would be two months and she'd literally be out on the street. Is his plan truly this horrible -- because that's just sick.

Multiply that by the tens of millions of retired people, and the tens of millions more who will be retiring in the next 20 years, and tell me if it's sustainable. We could tax the rich at 100% and not have the money to pay for it. What's really sick is that today's old people have not only spent every cent they've earned, they're now working on spending every cent their children and grandchildren will ever earn.

DrPainMD: I'm a-herpin' and a-derpin'

It's OK sweetie. As soon as Romney gets elected, your taxes will get raised , the 1% will have their taxes cut, and the deficit will get even bigger. But it won't matter then, because we elected white people who got everything they have because they were born to the elite. God Save The King!

DrPainMD: What's really sick is that today's old people have not only spent every cent they've earned, they're now working on spending every cent their children and grandchildren will ever earn.


So I can assume you're good with the paste plan then. Or at least senior hobo villages.

It's funny how different people find different things unsustainable. For me, it's shootin' brown people across the globe and liberating the shiat out of them. For you, it's one of our social safety nets. Whatever.

Vindibudd: The Lone Gunman: Bontesla: They're trying to capitalize on the "Not Obama" message. Ha. Unfortunately for them - Romney is actually incredibly unlikeable which allows Obama to capitalize on the "Not Romney" message.

The difference being that Obama can run on the 'ended operations in Iraq', 'killed bin Laden', 'gave businesses incentives to hire veterans', 'credit card reform', and 'ended DADT' message.

Meanwhile, Romney runs on the 'I made a lot of money' message.

Of course gitmo is still open, we're still in Afghanistan, we're another 4 trill deeper in debt as well. I bet you weren't gonna mention those parts were you?

First of all, who would run on "we're still in Afghanistan", etc?

Secondly, your three biggest criticisms of Obama are that he is continuing failed Republican policies.

Finally, I try to bring thought and wit to my posts, so your passive-aggressive 'I bet you weren't gonna mention those parts were you?' and F right off and the reason is can go F right off is because you're probably one of those guys who eats up the talking point that Obama is divisive, but gleefully ignores Michael Wiener (sorry, Michael SAVAGE) calling liberalism a 'mental disorder', Ann Coulter calling liberals godless, traitors, and demonic. And by 'called' them this, I mean that's how she titled her books. Also, upon winning the Congressional majority, Boehner saying things like 'The adults are back in charge,' That's not divisive either.

FU, is what I'm saying.

The Lone Gunman: Vindibudd: The Lone Gunman: Bontesla: They're trying to capitalize on the "Not Obama" message. Ha. Unfortunately for them - Romney is actually incredibly unlikeable which allows Obama to capitalize on the "Not Romney" message.

The difference being that Obama can run on the 'ended operations in Iraq', 'killed bin Laden', 'gave businesses incentives to hire veterans', 'credit card reform', and 'ended DADT' message.

Meanwhile, Romney runs on the 'I made a lot of money' message.

Of course gitmo is still open, we're still in Afghanistan, we're another 4 trill deeper in debt as well. I bet you weren't gonna mention those parts were you?

First of all, who would run on "we're still in Afghanistan", etc?

Secondly, your three biggest criticisms of Obama are that he is continuing failed Republican policies.

Finally, I try to bring thought and wit to my posts, so your passive-aggressive 'I bet you weren't gonna mention those parts were you?' and F right off and the reason is can go F right off is because you're probably one of those guys who eats up the talking point that Obama is divisive, but gleefully ignores Michael Wiener (sorry, Michael SAVAGE) calling liberalism a 'mental disorder', Ann Coulter calling liberals godless, traitors, and demonic. And by 'called' them this, I mean that's how she titled her books. Also, upon winning the Congressional majority, Boehner saying things like 'The adults are back in charge,' That's not divisive either.

FU, is what I'm saying.

Actually Ann Coulter has lost her mind and Michael Savage has always been an asshole. My point is that Obama can't run on the things he said he was going to do because he hasn't done them. It's painful when you realize your hero has failed you, I know. It's okay to lash out at the people pointing this out.

fatandolder: Obama plans to cut both medicare and tricare benefits. Let's discuss that.

Sure! While we're ascribing non-truths to people, let's go ahead and discuss another!

Vindibudd: The Lone Gunman: Vindibudd: The Lone Gunman: Bontesla: They're trying to capitalize on the "Not Obama" message. Ha. Unfortunately for them - Romney is actually incredibly unlikeable which allows Obama to capitalize on the "Not Romney" message.

The difference being that Obama can run on the 'ended operations in Iraq', 'killed bin Laden', 'gave businesses incentives to hire veterans', 'credit card reform', and 'ended DADT' message.

Meanwhile, Romney runs on the 'I made a lot of money' message.

Of course gitmo is still open, we're still in Afghanistan, we're another 4 trill deeper in debt as well. I bet you weren't gonna mention those parts were you?

First of all, who would run on "we're still in Afghanistan", etc?

Secondly, your three biggest criticisms of Obama are that he is continuing failed Republican policies.

Finally, I try to bring thought and wit to my posts, so your passive-aggressive 'I bet you weren't gonna mention those parts were you?' and F right off and the reason is can go F right off is because you're probably one of those guys who eats up the talking point that Obama is divisive, but gleefully ignores Michael Wiener (sorry, Michael SAVAGE) calling liberalism a 'mental disorder', Ann Coulter calling liberals godless, traitors, and demonic. And by 'called' them this, I mean that's how she titled her books. Also, upon winning the Congressional majority, Boehner saying things like 'The adults are back in charge,' That's not divisive either.

FU, is what I'm saying.

Actually Ann Coulter has lost her mind and Michael Savage has always been an asshole. My point is that Obama can't run on the things he said he was going to do because he hasn't done them. It's painful when you realize your hero has failed you, I know. It's okay to lash out at the people pointing this out.

We're withdrawing from Afghanistan, and so kind of YOU to omit the part that every time we do, the Right-Wing outrage is such that I'm pretty sure some of our soldiers are coming home with whiplash. And oh yes, Gitmo! The superpowered holding cell which, if closed, will unleash a bunch of indestructible super-villains who will ravage our poor, weak America-oh wait, sorry, more Right-Wing talking points.

/why is it that America is only strong in their words?

bdMurray: Notabunny: baronbloodbath: Aarontology: Can we turn the paste into biodiesel and solve two problems at once?

Soylent Green is people!

Soylent Green is corporations, my friend!

Soylent Green, Wet. Good.

That got me one hell of a chuckle. Welcome to my favorites.