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   Smart: Halting NJ Transit trains before superstorm Sandy. Dumb: Ignoring computer models and parking the trains in a known flood zone, because that's the way you've always done it

19 Nov 2012 11:26 AM   |   8429 clicks   |   Yahoo
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Dead for Tax Reasons     
But I thought 'zone A' on flood insurance maps meant 'a ok for storing trains'

19 Nov 2012 10:05 AM
ChipNASA     
In before:

www.bob-owens.comView Full Size

19 Nov 2012 11:30 AM
netcentric     
Orange people problems....

19 Nov 2012 11:32 AM
dj_bigbird    [TotalFark]  
What do they care? It's not their money, why should they give a shiat?

19 Nov 2012 11:33 AM
Summer Glau's Love Slave     
Uh oh. Someone's gonna get a memo!!!

/A pink memo, hopefully.

19 Nov 2012 11:33 AM
H31N0US     
Heads need to roll at NJT because of this.

The fact that Christi hasn't been all over this implies to me that he is protecting someone in that organization.

19 Nov 2012 11:35 AM
AlwaysRightBoy    [TotalFark]  
As a NJ Transit guy on the North Jersey Coast Line who hasn't had train service since the Superstorm Sandy hit... I'm totally not getting a kick.... 

/three hours at the Port Authority Bus station is the norm

19 Nov 2012 11:40 AM
Syphilis_Smile     
I already thought everyone who works for that organization should be purged even before the storm, now I have to wonder if they should be prosecuted for criminal negligence.

19 Nov 2012 11:40 AM
Nurglitch     
Dumb is conservatism in action.

19 Nov 2012 11:41 AM
s1ugg0     
I have ridden NJ Transit my entire life. While it has many good qualities the decision making has always been awful.

This news story comes as absolutely no surprise to anyone here in the Garden State.

19 Nov 2012 11:44 AM
Need_MindBleach     
I like the part about how the NJ Transit's sister railways had zero rail cars damaged, because they actually used their brains.

19 Nov 2012 11:45 AM
spmkk     
TFA: "James Weinstein, NJ Transit's executive director, said he did not expect the loss of equipment to have a significant effect on service in the coming weeks and months."


If not having this equipment won't make a difference in either short-term or long-term service, then why did who spend hundreds of millions of dollars in taxpayer and transit rider money on that equipment??

19 Nov 2012 11:45 AM
nytmare     
The orange community frowns on this shenanigan.

19 Nov 2012 11:46 AM
MemeSlave     
They're government employees, so they'll be fine. Act of God, etc. You, taxpayer, will pick up the tab.

19 Nov 2012 11:46 AM
technofiend     
Tell 'em their pension is getting docked 10% of any damage caused by the storm. That'll get their attention.

19 Nov 2012 11:50 AM
FreakinB    [TotalFark]  

s1ugg0: I have ridden NJ Transit my entire life. While it has many good qualities the decision making has always been awful.

This news story comes as absolutely no surprise to anyone here in the Garden State.


I'm a lifelong LIRR rider who also started riding NJT on a semi-regular basis recently. As much as I've biatched about LIRR, NJT is worse. At least on the LIRR my train tends to get in at the scheduled time on a consistent basis.

But this...I mean, it's a farking swamp in that area! Water everywhere. And even if it's never happened before, I don't see how you take your chances if the forecast is saying that this time will be different. They do have other places to put the trains.

19 Nov 2012 11:52 AM
PsychoPhil     
NJT screwed the pooch bigtime, here.

Not only did they flood out a good chunk of equipment, a lot of it was *brand new* equipment.v As in, they just took delivery of it this year. Can you say "Voided warranty"?

If you want to read sad, go to the NJT forum on railroad.net and read all the employees sticking up for NJT on there. Most of them argue "you don't work for a railroad, you don't know anything!!!111one!!. Apparently, that makes submerging 1/2 a billion dollars worth of new trains ok, in their eyes....

19 Nov 2012 12:06 PM
technofiend     

PsychoPhil:
If you want to read sad, go to the NJT forum on railroad.net and read all the employees sticking up for NJT on there. Most of them argue "you don't work for a railroad, you don't know anything!!!111one!!. Apparently, that makes submerging 1/2 a billion dollars worth of new trains ok, in their eyes....


Wait, are they trying to take a "too big to flood" defense? We know what we're doing, and if it turns out we don't, you have to fix it anyway at no cost to us.

19 Nov 2012 12:09 PM
H31N0US     
I've sent an email to the board of directors at NJT asking for resignations.

19 Nov 2012 12:14 PM
TheGreatGazoo     
They just wanted to get the trans washed off.

And you are right about the railroad.net forums. Wow. There has to be some tracks that are out of the flood plain, right? Just park them there and set the emergency brakes or whatever trains have (wheel chocks?) . Bonus if you can have it on an east-west line so it isn't blown over.

19 Nov 2012 12:17 PM
The Gordie Howe Hat Trick     
I vass juss followink ze orderz!!!

19 Nov 2012 12:19 PM
H31N0US     

TheGreatGazoo: They just wanted to get the trans washed off.

And you are right about the railroad.net forums. Wow. There has to be some tracks that are out of the flood plain, right? Just park them there and set the emergency brakes or whatever trains have (wheel chocks?) . Bonus if you can have it on an east-west line so it isn't blown over.


Yes, there were lots of places this stuff could have been stored.

I love how NJT omitted pictures of all this stock sitting in a flooded yard when they put their little slide show up showing the impact of Sandy. Lots of sensational pictures of a boat on the tracks though...which probably took a half day with a front end loader to clear.

I am beyond outraged at this. I pay $275 a month for crap service, and by next summer I expect another rise in ticket prices.

19 Nov 2012 12:25 PM
AlwaysRightBoy    [TotalFark]  

technofiend: PsychoPhil:
If you want to read sad, go to the NJT forum on railroad.net and read all the employees sticking up for NJT on there. Most of them argue "you don't work for a railroad, you don't know anything!!!111one!!. Apparently, that makes submerging 1/2 a billion dollars worth of new trains ok, in their eyes....

Wait, are they trying to take a "too big to flood" defense? We know what we're doing, and if it turns out we don't, you have to fix it anyway at no cost to us.


I've been taking NJT trains for over 17 years. At $400 plus a month, I'm re-thinking.

19 Nov 2012 12:25 PM
The Bestest     
railyard in question if anyone's curious..

How could it have possibly flooded?

19 Nov 2012 12:28 PM
styckx     

The Bestest: railyard in question if anyone's curious..

How could it have possibly flooded?


That looks like it would flood if someone left the sprinkler on for too long.

19 Nov 2012 12:32 PM
H31N0US     

AlwaysRightBoy: I've been taking NJT trains for over 17 years. At $400 plus a month, I'm re-thinking.


What are your options? Sitting on a bus or driving through the Lincoln?

I'm re-thinking living in Jersey. Or at least, re-thinking working in NYC.

19 Nov 2012 12:38 PM
mjohnson71     

PsychoPhil: NJT screwed the pooch bigtime, here.

Not only did they flood out a good chunk of equipment, a lot of it was *brand new* equipment.v As in, they just took delivery of it this year. Can you say "Voided warranty"?

If you want to read sad, go to the NJT forum on railroad.net and read all the employees sticking up for NJT on there. Most of them argue "you don't work for a railroad, you don't know anything!!!111one!!. Apparently, that makes submerging 1/2 a billion dollars worth of new trains ok, in their eyes....


I got ripped a new one here a few weeks ago when I biatched about people parking their cars in underground parking garages in lower Manhattan. Because parking is so tough in New York City, it's okay to put your car below sea level and anyone who questions it is a complete idiot.

19 Nov 2012 12:44 PM
styckx     

mjohnson71: PsychoPhil: NJT screwed the pooch bigtime, here.

Not only did they flood out a good chunk of equipment, a lot of it was *brand new* equipment.v As in, they just took delivery of it this year. Can you say "Voided warranty"?

If you want to read sad, go to the NJT forum on railroad.net and read all the employees sticking up for NJT on there. Most of them argue "you don't work for a railroad, you don't know anything!!!111one!!. Apparently, that makes submerging 1/2 a billion dollars worth of new trains ok, in their eyes....

I got ripped a new one here a few weeks ago when I biatched about people parking their cars in underground parking garages in lower Manhattan. Because parking is so tough in New York City, it's okay to put your car below sea level and anyone who questions it is a complete idiot.


Wait people had excuses for that shiat? How about they park their car further away where there is parking. And then, you know because New York is a 24/7 beehive of taxi's take a cab home..

19 Nov 2012 12:58 PM
Misch    [TotalFark]  

The Bestest: railyard in question if anyone's curious..

How could it have possibly flooded?


Answer becomes more obvious when you scroll out a little and turn it back to maps mode.

19 Nov 2012 01:04 PM
AlwaysRightBoy    [TotalFark]  

H31N0US: AlwaysRightBoy: I've been taking NJT trains for over 17 years. At $400 plus a month, I'm re-thinking.

What are your options? Sitting on a bus or driving through the Lincoln?

I'm re-thinking living in Jersey. Or at least, re-thinking working in NYC.


Not much.

Down here at the Jersey shore, there's plenty of ferries but you have to be a Wall Street guy. It's kind of sad for us working people
/lives a mile from the Belford ferry
.

19 Nov 2012 01:07 PM
sodomizer     
Government employees: a richly deserved reputation for incompetence, laziness and arrogance.

19 Nov 2012 01:26 PM
AlwaysRightBoy    [TotalFark]  

H31N0US: AlwaysRightBoy: I've been taking NJT trains for over 17 years. At $400 plus a month, I'm re-thinking.

What are your options? Sitting on a bus or driving through the Lincoln?

I'm re-thinking living in Jersey. Or at least, re-thinking working in NYC.


Can I just say: through the good and the bad, the bad rules

19 Nov 2012 01:27 PM
PsychoPhil     

technofiend: PsychoPhil:
If you want to read sad, go to the NJT forum on railroad.net and read all the employees sticking up for NJT on there. Most of them argue "you don't work for a railroad, you don't know anything!!!111one!!. Apparently, that makes submerging 1/2 a billion dollars worth of new trains ok, in their eyes....

Wait, are they trying to take a "too big to flood" defense? We know what we're doing, and if it turns out we don't, you have to fix it anyway at no cost to us.


Pretty much. They're all saying "STFU, we're the experts, you're not, go away". if it were a private firm, it's be fun to watch. But this is NJ's taxpayer dollars....

The best part? Like I said, BRAND NEW equipment, flooded out with saltwater. Including a good number of new and VERY expensive locomotives. I bet at least a few will be problem children for years, if not total lemons. Bombardier likely won't warranty the units, meaning NJ's left holding the bag.

And yet, there are folks defending NJT's actions....

19 Nov 2012 01:30 PM
snocone    [TotalFark]  

PsychoPhil: technofiend: PsychoPhil:
If you want to read sad, go to the NJT forum on railroad.net and read all the employees sticking up for NJT on there. Most of them argue "you don't work for a railroad, you don't know anything!!!111one!!. Apparently, that makes submerging 1/2 a billion dollars worth of new trains ok, in their eyes....

Wait, are they trying to take a "too big to flood" defense? We know what we're doing, and if it turns out we don't, you have to fix it anyway at no cost to us.

Pretty much. They're all saying "STFU, we're the experts, you're not, go away". if it were a private firm, it's be fun to watch. But this is NJ's taxpayer dollars....

The best part? Like I said, BRAND NEW equipment, flooded out with saltwater. Including a good number of new and VERY expensive locomotives. I bet at least a few will be problem children for years, if not total lemons. Bombardier likely won't warranty the units, meaning NJ's left holding the bag.

And yet, there are folks defending NJT's actions....


Umm, next set of self appointed "experts", please. These didn't work out.

19 Nov 2012 01:32 PM
ladyfortuna     
I know this sucks for those who live there (and relatives, considering the holidays) but in the long run it might be good for the economy. Where I live, there's a big train car factory that shut down a few years ago and laid everyone off because they 'couldn't get any orders' for trains or refurbishing jobs (they kept bidding a lot higher than other companies).

They recently started back up for some refurb jobs, but if entire cities have to replace Sandy damaged trains, I bet they and the other companies are actually going to get some work for quite a while. Not being insensitive with this observation as I really feel terrible for people who depend on public transportation, just mulling the future...

19 Nov 2012 01:33 PM
Skirl Hutsenreiter     

Need_MindBleach: I like the part about how the NJ Transit's sister railways had zero rail cars damaged, because they actually used their brains.


Didn't you read where that NJ Transit guy said they had no reason to think the yard would flood? I think it was just a few paragraphs after the part that said the weather service model as of Sunday evening said the yard would flood.

But there was no reason to think it would flood.

19 Nov 2012 01:34 PM
styckx     

PsychoPhil: technofiend: PsychoPhil:
If you want to read sad, go to the NJT forum on railroad.net and read all the employees sticking up for NJT on there. Most of them argue "you don't work for a railroad, you don't know anything!!!111one!!. Apparently, that makes submerging 1/2 a billion dollars worth of new trains ok, in their eyes....

Wait, are they trying to take a "too big to flood" defense? We know what we're doing, and if it turns out we don't, you have to fix it anyway at no cost to us.

Pretty much. They're all saying "STFU, we're the experts, you're not, go away". if it were a private firm, it's be fun to watch. But this is NJ's taxpayer dollars....

The best part? Like I said, BRAND NEW equipment, flooded out with saltwater. Including a good number of new and VERY expensive locomotives. I bet at least a few will be problem children for years, if not total lemons. Bombardier likely won't warranty the units, meaning NJ's left holding the bag.

And yet, there are folks defending NJT's actions....


Foamers are the Juggalos of transportation enthusiasts. These are usually the same retards who upload videos to Youtube of them trainspotting on private property, rail scanner on, always bragging about knowing someone who works for _____ railroad and constantly using insider talk that real life rail employees don't even use.

19 Nov 2012 01:35 PM
PsychoPhil     

H31N0US: AlwaysRightBoy: I've been taking NJT trains for over 17 years. At $400 plus a month, I'm re-thinking.

What are your options? Sitting on a bus or driving through the Lincoln?

I'm re-thinking living in Jersey. Or at least, re-thinking working in NYC.


My job is distributed around the state, and sometime out on long Island. My cow-orkers refuse to take projects out on LI, so I often get stuck with them. You think driving in NJ is bad, try LI some day. Rush hour - style traffic darn near 24/7.

I'd kill myself if I had to go into NYC every day and relied on NJT for it. I just couldn't do that to myself...

19 Nov 2012 01:37 PM
HiFiGuy     
NJT should have parked more trains inside the Bergen Tunnels above Hoboken. (Did they park any there?)

/Suffern to Hoboken commuter
//Used to be 1:50 door to door, now it's about 2:30.
///Don't take the bus; take the ferry, if possible.

19 Nov 2012 01:42 PM
AlwaysRightBoy    [TotalFark]  

PsychoPhil: H31N0US: AlwaysRightBoy: I've been taking NJT trains for over 17 years. At $400 plus a month, I'm re-thinking.

What are your options? Sitting on a bus or driving through the Lincoln?

I'm re-thinking living in Jersey. Or at least, re-thinking working in NYC.

My job is distributed around the state, and sometime out on long Island. My cow-orkers refuse to take projects out on LI, so I often get stuck with them. You think driving in NJ is bad, try LI some day. Rush hour - style traffic darn near 24/7.

I'd kill myself if I had to go into NYC every day and relied on NJT for it. I just couldn't do that to myself...


I have a passion for life.....

19 Nov 2012 01:44 PM
groppet     
I wonder if we are gonna see Sandy cars like we did with Katrina cars on used car lots soon.

19 Nov 2012 01:49 PM
OscarTamerz     
Oh noes, we hafta buy $385 million of new trains. So that means $40 million in bribes and off shore accounts. I'm sure they all feel $40 million worth of terrible.

www.csmonitor.comView Full Size

19 Nov 2012 01:50 PM
FreakinB    [TotalFark]  

PsychoPhil: You think driving in NJ is bad, try LI some day. Rush hour - style traffic darn near 24/7.


As someone who splits time between LI and NJ and works in Manhattan:

Under no circumstances would I ever consider driving to/from either at normal rush hour. However, I often have to work late (11 or midnight or so) and my company will get me a car if that happens. In my experience, Long Island is more likely to have traffic than NJ at that time. Actually it's more Queens, but you have to go through there to get to LI. Not that NJ's perfect, but at least the Turnpike has a lot of lanes. The LIE? Not so much.

I can't remember the last time I was driving during rush hour. Must be soul-sucking.

19 Nov 2012 01:51 PM
wambu     
But it's the designated parking area for crissake! Talk to my union rep.

19 Nov 2012 01:52 PM
BitwiseShift     
Just in case this salty story was on purpose, NJT trains could be repaired in NY. Of course, they'd have to go on a barge to get there. I'm sure Chris Christie wants a little facetime with NJT decision makers.

19 Nov 2012 01:52 PM
H31N0US     

BitwiseShift: I'm sure Chris Christie wants a little facetime with NJT decision makers.


BitwiseShift: Just in case this salty story was on purpose, NJT trains could be repaired in NY. Of course, they'd have to go on a barge to get there. I'm sure Chris Christie wants a little facetime with NJT decision makers.


He's on the board of directors.

19 Nov 2012 02:01 PM
Sean M     
Gotta love that Union mentality. "We do it this way because we've always done it this way."

19 Nov 2012 02:04 PM
PsychoPhil     

Sean M: Gotta love that Union mentality. "We do it this way because we've always done it this way."


I'm not one to defend unions, but in this case it looks like NJT's terminally brain dead management is to blame. Weinstein in particular should be fired, he's been a shiatty executive director. And he's running in competition with losers like Warrington.

/bring back Warsh, at least he had an eye to the future....

19 Nov 2012 02:08 PM
technofiend     

H31N0US: AlwaysRightBoy: I've been taking NJT trains for over 17 years. At $400 plus a month, I'm re-thinking.

What are your options? Sitting on a bus or driving through the Lincoln?

I'm re-thinking living in Jersey. Or at least, re-thinking working in NYC.


Seems like a logical conclusion, man. At some point the benefits of working in the city are outweighed by the negatives. It's not like you work on the street.

19 Nov 2012 02:12 PM
PyroStock     
because that's the way you've always done it

Ah yes... the ignorant/lazy/arrogant boss whose mantra is "because that's the way we've always done it". I have worked for too many of them. So glad to have my own business now.

fc06.deviantart.netView Full Size

19 Nov 2012 02:19 PM
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