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   While you were lying in a turkey coma, China just printed the plans for WWIII on their passports

23 Nov 2012 12:22 PM   |   16192 clicks   |   Sydney Morning Herald
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jaylectricity    [TotalFark]  
Can somebody smarter than me (read: all of you) explain how this means WWIII? I skimmed the article and it looked like they just included a couple of islands that didn't want to be known as China.

23 Nov 2012 10:36 AM
Marcus Aurelius    [TotalFark]  

jaylectricity: Can somebody smarter than me (read: all of you) explain how this means WWIII? I skimmed the article and it looked like they just included a couple of islands that didn't want to be known as China.


I think we're bound to defend Japan via treaties signed post-WWII, and we're politically obligated to back up Taiwan. Ergo if the Chinese attacks either one, we could be drawn into the fracas.

Not sure Europe would get involved though, so it would be more like trans-Pacific war II.

23 Nov 2012 10:55 AM
cman    [TotalFark]  
FTA

Vietnam's government lodged a formal complaint with the Chinese embassy in Hanoi.

That is like slapping a lady who sucked you off

23 Nov 2012 11:03 AM
Paris1127    [TotalFark]  

cman: FTA

Vietnam's government lodged a formal complaint with the Chinese embassy in Hanoi.

That is like slapping a lady who sucked you off


China and Vietnam have a complex relationship... The Vietnamese really don't like China, at least that's what it seems. While the relationship started out well, with China aiding North Vietnam during the American War (as they call it), it soured when China invaded the country in '79. Hanoi had a closer relationship with Moscow than with Beijing, and Beijing thought Hanoi was involved in a Soviet conspiracy to surround China.

23 Nov 2012 12:13 PM
MikeMc     
Way to include a picture of said passport map.

23 Nov 2012 12:25 PM
ltdanman44     
www-03.ibm.comView Full Size

23 Nov 2012 12:26 PM
FrancoFile     
They're just compensating for their small penises.

23 Nov 2012 12:27 PM
indarwinsshadow     
api.ning.comView Full Size

23 Nov 2012 12:28 PM
Arkanaut    [TotalFark]  

Paris1127: cman: FTA

Vietnam's government lodged a formal complaint with the Chinese embassy in Hanoi.

That is like slapping a lady who sucked you off

China and Vietnam have a complex relationship... The Vietnamese really don't like China, at least that's what it seems. While the relationship started out well, with China aiding North Vietnam during the American War (as they call it), it soured when China invaded the country in '79. Hanoi had a closer relationship with Moscow than with Beijing, and Beijing thought Hanoi was involved in a Soviet conspiracy to surround China.


IIRC the relationship wasn't that good even before '79. I remember reading that during the Vietnam War China was stealing supplies that the USSR was sending to Vietnam when the trains stopped in China.

23 Nov 2012 12:30 PM
oldfarthenry     
Ah well. It ain't the first time 'merikuh was tardy for a world war cuz they slept in. Amirite?

23 Nov 2012 12:30 PM
Relatively Obscure    [TotalFark]  
I'm not worried. I just played through Fallout 3 Operation: Anchorage again, so my skills are sharp.

23 Nov 2012 12:31 PM
BolloxReader     

Paris1127: cman: FTA

Vietnam's government lodged a formal complaint with the Chinese embassy in Hanoi.

That is like slapping a lady who sucked you off

China and Vietnam have a complex relationship... The Vietnamese really don't like China, at least that's what it seems. While the relationship started out well, with China aiding North Vietnam during the American War (as they call it), it soured when China invaded the country in '79. Hanoi had a closer relationship with Moscow than with Beijing, and Beijing thought Hanoi was involved in a Soviet conspiracy to surround China.


There's a reason the military in Myanmar decided to give democracy a chance. They've literally been begging for several years to be let in the US sphere of influence so that China doesn't suck them dry.

And it scares me that despite all our faults, China is bad enough to provoke this response in far-off lands. The countries around China are all terrified of what closer economic relations with Beijing would bring them.

23 Nov 2012 12:32 PM
gilatrout     
Dang, they sure know how to dial it all the way up to XI.

23 Nov 2012 12:40 PM
maggoo     

jaylectricity: Can somebody smarter than me (read: all of you) explain how this means WWIII? I skimmed the article and it looked like they just included a couple of islands that didn't want to be known as China.


Let's just say that the USA is building a military base in Australia just because of those "couple of islands". Read here.

And those "couple of islands" are enough to grant the country that controls them the rights to significant deposits of minerals, oil, and gas, not to mention fisheries. read here.

World wars have been fought for less.

23 Nov 2012 12:49 PM
jjorsett     

Paris1127: cman: FTA

Vietnam's government lodged a formal complaint with the Chinese embassy in Hanoi.

That is like slapping a lady who sucked you off

China and Vietnam have a complex relationship... The Vietnamese really don't like China, at least that's what it seems. While the relationship started out well, with China aiding North Vietnam during the American War (as they call it), it soured when China invaded the country in '79. Hanoi had a closer relationship with Moscow than with Beijing, and Beijing thought Hanoi was involved in a Soviet conspiracy to surround China.


It also didn't help relations when post-war Vietnam purged its ethnically Chinese population using boats in what was described as "a seagoing Final Solution."

23 Nov 2012 12:51 PM
mygodcreatedyourgod     
They did the same thing with Tibet. Included it on maps of China based on ridiculous thousands of year old claims. So they know this works, it only takes a few generations.

23 Nov 2012 12:56 PM
freewill    [TotalFark]  
jaypgreene.files.wordpress.comView Full Size

23 Nov 2012 12:58 PM
whither_apophis     

Marcus Aurelius: jaylectricity: Can somebody smarter than me (read: all of you) explain how this means WWIII? I skimmed the article and it looked like they just included a couple of islands that didn't want to be known as China.

I think we're bound to defend Japan via treaties signed post-WWII, and we're politically obligated to back up Taiwan. Ergo if the Chinese attacks either one, we could be drawn into the fracas.

Not sure Europe would get involved though, so it would be more like trans-Pacific war II.


Well from the Chinese pov everything west of Beijing is historically Chinese land, since the Mongol Empire made it into Russia and Turkey, Europe will be involved.

23 Nov 2012 12:59 PM
Spare Me     
By the logic they're using, next thing you know, they will be claiming North America because they beat Columbus to the New World by 70 years.

Link

23 Nov 2012 01:10 PM
SirEattonHogg     
gilatrout

2012-11-23 12:40:25 PM

Dang, they sure know how to dial it all the way up to XI.


I think you mean dial up to "shi yi".

It's funny how everyone mentions Japan and Taiwan on these things but no one mentions we also have a mutual defense treaty with the Philippines, which arguebly would be triggered in a war with China if you guys don't pussy out and say "oh well the Spratleys are really Chinese territory". Not to mention a fairly close relationship in terms of history (former colony for roughly 50 years), its a democracy and 6 billion dollars worth of investment.

And if friendship doesn't mean much to you, then maybe we should mention there is oil deposits there. Lots of it. Good luck in negotiating with the Chinese for drill rights.

23 Nov 2012 01:11 PM
Lunaville     

jjorsett: Paris1127: cman: FTA

Vietnam's government lodged a formal complaint with the Chinese embassy in Hanoi.

That is like slapping a lady who sucked you off

China and Vietnam have a complex relationship... The Vietnamese really don't like China, at least that's what it seems. While the relationship started out well, with China aiding North Vietnam during the American War (as they call it), it soured when China invaded the country in '79. Hanoi had a closer relationship with Moscow than with Beijing, and Beijing thought Hanoi was involved in a Soviet conspiracy to surround China.

It also didn't help relations when post-war Vietnam purged its ethnically Chinese population using boats in what was described as "a seagoing Final Solution."


When we were briefly in Vietnam, I was surprised by the anti-Chinese sentiment since the Chinese had ostensibly been their ally during what is referred to their as the American war. It was a very interesting a different point of view to me, when the guide explained that the Vietnamese people resented being put in a position of needing China as an ally. Vietnam struck me as the most capitalist place I'd ever seen. The guide went on to explain that I was witnessing a much improved situation after a Vietnamese struggle to emerge from excessive influence by the Chinese government and the hardliners the Chinese endorsed.

I did not, however, witness, anti-Chinese sentiment directed towards individuals who had immigrated into Vietnam. On the contrary, a Chinese business district was pointed out and we were urged to check it out and eat Chinese. The immigrants from China were described as extremely hardworking and an asset to Vietnam.

We also were taken by "the best strip club in Vietnam" which was hilarious because we were a bus full of families with young children. After his effusive praise, the guide turned around to a bus full of grim looking moms with expressions kind of like or :/ or :{ and his voice just trailed off.

23 Nov 2012 01:13 PM
Lunaville     

Lunaville: jjorsett: Paris1127: cman: FTA

Vietnam's government lodged a formal complaint with the Chinese embassy in Hanoi.

That is like slapping a lady who sucked you off

China and Vietnam have a complex relationship... The Vietnamese really don't like China, at least that's what it seems. While the relationship started out well, with China aiding North Vietnam during the American War (as they call it), it soured when China invaded the country in '79. Hanoi had a closer relationship with Moscow than with Beijing, and Beijing thought Hanoi was involved in a Soviet conspiracy to surround China.

It also didn't help relations when post-war Vietnam purged its ethnically Chinese population using boats in what was described as "a seagoing Final Solution."

When we were briefly in Vietnam, I was surprised by the anti-Chinese sentiment since the Chinese had ostensibly been their ally during what is referred to theirthere as the American war. It was a very interesting and different point of view to me, when the guide explained that the Vietnamese people resented being put in a position of needing China as an ally. Vietnam struck me as the most capitalist place I'd ever seen. The guide went on to explain that I was witnessing a much improved situation after a Vietnamese struggle to emerge from excessive influence by the Chinese government and the hardliners the Chinese endorsed.

I did not, however, witness, anti-Chinese sentiment directed towards individuals who had immigrated into Vietnam. On the contrary, a Chinese business district was pointed out and we were urged to check it out and eat Chinese. The immigrants from China were described as extremely hardworking and an asset to Vietnam.

We also were taken by "the best strip club in Vietnam" which was hilarious because we were a bus full of families with young children. After his effusive praise, the guide turned around to a bus full of grim looking moms with expressions kind of like or :/ or :{ and his voice just trailed off.


I'm sorry, I seem to be having some sort of stroke that exclusively affects my ability to communicate in standard English.

23 Nov 2012 01:17 PM
Silverstaff     

whither_apophis: Marcus Aurelius: jaylectricity: Can somebody smarter than me (read: all of you) explain how this means WWIII? I skimmed the article and it looked like they just included a couple of islands that didn't want to be known as China.

I think we're bound to defend Japan via treaties signed post-WWII, and we're politically obligated to back up Taiwan. Ergo if the Chinese attacks either one, we could be drawn into the fracas.

Not sure Europe would get involved though, so it would be more like trans-Pacific war II.

Well from the Chinese pov everything west of Beijing is historically Chinese land, since the Mongol Empire made it into Russia and Turkey, Europe will be involved.


From the traditional Chinese POV, almost everything is China.

Remember, that in Imperial China, the Emperor was considered to hold the "mandate of Heaven" to rule everything. Foreign kings were not seen as rulers in their own right, but as potentates who ruled by the grace and permission of the Emperor. Ambassadors visiting China were not seen as envoys of other countries, but as the messengers from the most distant parts of the Empire.

Only the massive, and fairly humiliating, smack-downs they got in the 19th century from the British really started to dull the idea that China was the one true sovereign ruler of the world, but the idea is still ingrained pretty deeply into Chinese political thought. If not the entire world, then certainly every place the Chinese Empire had any contact with or ever bothered to travel is something they though of as "part of China".

Pretty much any country that ever had diplomatic ties to Imperial-era China is something China could make a hazy claim of being "part of China" based on how they sent envoys to the Imperial court to pay homage to the Emperor and receive Imperial sanction and blessing for their own rulers.

23 Nov 2012 01:19 PM
Insatiable Jesus     
www.jeffhead.comView Full Size


Only one reason to build this.

23 Nov 2012 01:24 PM
SirEattonHogg     
Spare Me

2012-11-23 01:10:59 PM

By the logic they're using, next thing you know, they will be claiming North America because they beat Columbus to the New World by 70 years.

Link


Ah yes, Galvin Menzies. The great fiction writer. Pretty soon he'll claim that the Chinese were contracted to build the Incan pyramids.

23 Nov 2012 01:32 PM
skylabdown     
I wonder if there are any General Tso's in the Chinese Army.

23 Nov 2012 01:34 PM
meyerkev     

Insatiable Jesus: [www.jeffhead.com image 850x637]

Only one reason to build this.


Question: Does the ramp actually do anything?

23 Nov 2012 01:35 PM
Insatiable Jesus     

SirEattonHogg: Spare Me

2012-11-23 01:10:59 PM

By the logic they're using, next thing you know, they will be claiming North America because they beat Columbus to the New World by 70 years.

Link


Ah yes, Galvin Menzies. The great fiction writer. Pretty soon he'll claim that the Chinese were contracted to build the Incan pyramids.



Deemed by the British Govt to be a "vexatious litigant", lol. He's so stupid they won't let him use the legal system without supervision.

23 Nov 2012 01:38 PM
jaylectricity    [TotalFark]  

Silverstaff: whither_apophis: Marcus Aurelius: jaylectricity: Can somebody smarter than me (read: all of you) explain how this means WWIII? I skimmed the article and it looked like they just included a couple of islands that didn't want to be known as China.

I think we're bound to defend Japan via treaties signed post-WWII, and we're politically obligated to back up Taiwan. Ergo if the Chinese attacks either one, we could be drawn into the fracas.

Not sure Europe would get involved though, so it would be more like trans-Pacific war II.

Well from the Chinese pov everything west of Beijing is historically Chinese land, since the Mongol Empire made it into Russia and Turkey, Europe will be involved.

From the traditional Chinese POV, almost everything is China.

Remember, that in Imperial China, the Emperor was considered to hold the "mandate of Heaven" to rule everything. Foreign kings were not seen as rulers in their own right, but as potentates who ruled by the grace and permission of the Emperor. Ambassadors visiting China were not seen as envoys of other countries, but as the messengers from the most distant parts of the Empire.

Only the massive, and fairly humiliating, smack-downs they got in the 19th century from the British really started to dull the idea that China was the one true sovereign ruler of the world, but the idea is still ingrained pretty deeply into Chinese political thought. If not the entire world, then certainly every place the Chinese Empire had any contact with or ever bothered to travel is something they though of as "part of China".

Pretty much any country that ever had diplomatic ties to Imperial-era China is something China could make a hazy claim of being "part of China" based on how they sent envoys to the Imperial court to pay homage to the Emperor and receive Imperial sanction and blessing for their own rulers.


That's pretty bizarre, is that true?

23 Nov 2012 01:39 PM
Lunaville     

meyerkev: Insatiable Jesus: [www.jeffhead.com image 850x637]

Only one reason to build this.

Question: Does the ramp actually do anything?


I suspect it lets people get on and off the ship.

23 Nov 2012 01:40 PM
spawn73     

Marcus Aurelius: jaylectricity: Can somebody smarter than me (read: all of you) explain how this means WWIII? I skimmed the article and it looked like they just included a couple of islands that didn't want to be known as China.

I think we're bound to defend Japan via treaties signed post-WWII, and we're politically obligated to back up Taiwan. Ergo if the Chinese attacks either one, we could be drawn into the fracas.

Not sure Europe would get involved though, so it would be more like trans-Pacific war II.


It was interesting how PRC included islands in dispute with Vietnam, but chose not to include ones they're disputing with Japan. I guess that shows which one of those countries they respect more.

There wouldn't be any issues with Taiwan, as both PRC and Taiwan agrees that all of it belongs to the same nation.

/Europe would probably go to war if you turn your back on them. Has Poland and Germany even agreed on their borders yet? Maybe Germany wants something back from Russia. Russia will be pissed if Belarussia or Ukraine decides to cut their ties with Russia in favour of the EU. Kazakstan has tons of oil, they looks tasty to the EU as well. There's lots of fun stuff to pick up on. :P

23 Nov 2012 01:42 PM
DarkSkyForever     

meyerkev: Insatiable Jesus: [www.jeffhead.com image 850x637]

Only one reason to build this.

Question: Does the ramp actually do anything?


Let's you take your bike off of some sweet jumps.

23 Nov 2012 01:42 PM
spawn73     

Spare Me: By the logic they're using, next thing you know, they will be claiming North America because they beat Columbus to the New World by 70 years.

Link


But the vikings were there before the Chinese. The vikings also settled, so that's kinda undisputed.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/L'Anse_a ux_Meadows

23 Nov 2012 01:49 PM
SirEattonHogg     
Insatiable Jesus

2012-11-23 01:24:49 PM
Only one reason to build this.


Sell your East Asian allies some nice "carrier killer" missles or some subs, and that thing will be good for target practice.

23 Nov 2012 01:59 PM
Latinwolf    [TotalFark]  
Lunaville: We also were taken by "the best strip club in Vietnam" which was hilarious because we were a bus full of families with young children. After his effusive praise, the guide turned around to a bus full of grim looking moms with expressions kind of like or :/ or :{ and his voice just trailed off.

I suspect that a pic of those moms would make for a good Fark meme.

23 Nov 2012 02:06 PM
clyph     

Insatiable Jesus: Only one reason to build this.


USN target practice?

And they didn't build it. They bought the rusting hulk of the Varyag from the Russians and refurbished it.

The Kuznetsov class isn't very impressive as aircraft carriers go. It's barely a match for a Wasp class LHD (in it's sea control/light carrier configuration).

It's academic anyway since they don't have an air wing for it yet - the Russians won't sell them SU-33s and their knock-off (the J-15) is still in development. Nor do they have decent AAW and ASW escort vessels to screen it. The SU-33 is a pretty modern design and could conceivably go toe-to-toe with an F/A-18, given a good pilot and decent missiles (neither of which China has, but that's besides the point). Of course by the time they have the J-15 operational we'll have the F-35b/c online, which will completely outclass it.

In other words, this carrier, it's air wing, and supporting battle group might as well have bulleyes painted on them as far as the USN is concerned.

23 Nov 2012 02:11 PM
clyph     

meyerkev: Question: Does the ramp actually do anything?


Yes, it lets them fly conventional fixed-wing aircraft off of it, as long as they have a low enough stall speed. It doesn't have catapults - any embarked aircraft have to be able to take off under their own power. Without the ski-jump they could only fly vtol/v-stol planes off of it.

23 Nov 2012 02:18 PM
FatherChaos    [TotalFark]  
images1.wikia.nocookie.netView Full Size


BE READY, AMERICA!

23 Nov 2012 02:33 PM
way south     

meyerkev: Insatiable Jesus: [www.jeffhead.com image 850x637]

Only one reason to build this.

Question: Does the ramp actually do anything?


Yes.
American carriers use a catapult to help their aircraft reach takeoff speeds, the Russians and British use a ramp to give you a tad more altitude.
I understand its less stressful on the vehicle and saves alot of money on equipment, but it also means you can only takeoff with just the right headwind and it limits the kinds of aircraft that can operate.

Whether its better is a matter of debate, since the Russians only have one carrier and the British used theirs with jump jets and helicopters.

The Chinese are basically copying a little from everyone. Russian styled ships, F-35 styled fighters.

23 Nov 2012 02:48 PM
ciberido     

clyph: In other words, this carrier, it's air wing, and supporting battle group might as well have bulleyes painted on them as far as the USN is concerned.


I just hope that the United States will bot fall victim to one of the classic blunders.

23 Nov 2012 02:55 PM
Solon Isonomia     

ciberido: clyph: In other words, this carrier, it's air wing, and supporting battle group might as well have bulleyes painted on them as far as the USN is concerned.

I just hope that the United States will bot fall victim to one of the classic blunders.


The Korean, Vietnam, and Afghanistan Wars called: they'd like to talk.

23 Nov 2012 03:24 PM
ObscureNameHere     

ciberido: clyph: In other words, this carrier, it's air wing, and supporting battle group might as well have bulleyes painted on them as far as the USN is concerned.

I just hope that the United States will bot fall victim to one of the classic blunders.


Not that I *know* at all, but having read some history, especially of the Cold War, it is a fairly safe bet that every major Chinese military port is under constant shadow by U.S. subs. I expect in the case of a hot war, most major ships of the Chinese navy has a life expectancy of a few minutes at best.

23 Nov 2012 03:48 PM
Marcus Aurelius    [TotalFark]  

BolloxReader: Paris1127: cman: FTA

Vietnam's government lodged a formal complaint with the Chinese embassy in Hanoi.

That is like slapping a lady who sucked you off

China and Vietnam have a complex relationship... The Vietnamese really don't like China, at least that's what it seems. While the relationship started out well, with China aiding North Vietnam during the American War (as they call it), it soured when China invaded the country in '79. Hanoi had a closer relationship with Moscow than with Beijing, and Beijing thought Hanoi was involved in a Soviet conspiracy to surround China.

There's a reason the military in Myanmar decided to give democracy a chance. They've literally been begging for several years to be let in the US sphere of influence so that China doesn't suck them dry.

And it scares me that despite all our faults, China is bad enough to provoke this response in far-off lands. The countries around China are all terrified of what closer economic relations with Beijing would bring them.


The crap?

/me so solly

23 Nov 2012 04:40 PM
oldtaku     
The nice thing here is that they're just further pissing off all their neighbors, who already feel ambivalent about China's sprawling acquisitiveness and exploitation. Even (especially) the ones with heavy Chinese investment.

Same sort of thing the US is/was guilty of, so it helps when China's currently even worse.

23 Nov 2012 04:48 PM
Eddie Adams from Torrance    [TotalFark]  
i236.photobucket.comView Full Size


Does not approve.

23 Nov 2012 04:54 PM
Marcus Aurelius    [TotalFark]  

oldtaku: The nice thing here is that they're just further pissing off all their neighbors, who already feel ambivalent about China's sprawling acquisitiveness and exploitation. Even (especially) the ones with heavy Chinese investment.

Same sort of thing the US is/was guilty of, so it helps when China's currently even worse.


China hasn't truly hit hard economic times since their boom phase. The chickens will come home to roost. Probably during Obama's second term, which is good, because that means there probably won't be a war in Asia.

23 Nov 2012 04:54 PM
Lunaville     
It occurs to me that this country, the USA, can't go 12 hours without a designated super enemy. I guess a lack of such an enemy would make it harder to sell our military industrial complex to the American people.

23 Nov 2012 07:49 PM
Mad_Flyer     

way south: meyerkev: Insatiable Jesus: [www.jeffhead.com image 850x637]

Only one reason to build this.

Question: Does the ramp actually do anything?

Yes.
American carriers use a catapult to help their aircraft reach takeoff speeds, the Russians and British use a ramp to give you a tad more altitude.
I understand its less stressful on the vehicle and saves alot of money on equipment, but it also means you can only takeoff with just the right headwind and it limits the kinds of aircraft that can operate.

Whether its better is a matter of debate, since the Russians only have one carrier and the British used theirs with jump jets and helicopters.

The Chinese are basically copying a little from everyone. Russian styled ships, F-35 styled fighters.



Xcept' they are not copying anything for this boat since they just bought discarded hulls from the Russian who never really got around doing something usefull out of these pile of rusting steel...

If you want to launch loaded strike fighters from a boat you really need catapults...
An aircraft carrier without strike mission launch capabilities is not of any use...
China did a really bad move with that thing... But, guys, never disturb an enemy while he's busy doing a mistake.

24 Nov 2012 12:55 AM
saugoof     
This is more of a beat-up story than anything to particularly worry about. Those islands have been disputed for decades. It's not exactly anything new.

24 Nov 2012 05:19 AM
way south     

Mad_Flyer: way south: meyerkev: Insatiable Jesus: [www.jeffhead.com image 850x637]

Only one reason to build this.

Question: Does the ramp actually do anything?

Yes.
American carriers use a catapult to help their aircraft reach takeoff speeds, the Russians and British use a ramp to give you a tad more altitude.
I understand its less stressful on the vehicle and saves alot of money on equipment, but it also means you can only takeoff with just the right headwind and it limits the kinds of aircraft that can operate.

Whether its better is a matter of debate, since the Russians only have one carrier and the British used theirs with jump jets and helicopters.

The Chinese are basically copying a little from everyone. Russian styled ships, F-35 styled fighters.


Xcept' they are not copying anything for this boat since they just bought discarded hulls from the Russian who never really got around doing something usefull out of these pile of rusting steel...

If you want to launch loaded strike fighters from a boat you really need catapults...
An aircraft carrier without strike mission launch capabilities is not of any use...
China did a really bad move with that thing... But, guys, never disturb an enemy while he's busy doing a mistake.


I'd agree for the most part, except that another reason for owning a carrier (besides force projection) is the political influence it gives you.

China wants to negotiate with dozens of island states who barely have air forces, much less navies. Having a fleet of ships to embolden their friends and intimidate their opponents is a handy thing.
...and these days, no fleet is complete without a carrier.

/maybe this seemed like the cheapest option at the time.
/no telling until they actually try to deploy the thing.

24 Nov 2012 06:31 AM
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