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   The Hostess story is worse than originally thought: Turns out they were stealing pension funds to pay for operation costs. Those damn unions

10 Dec 2012 05:24 PM   |   25862 clicks   |   ABC Local
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Runs_With_Scissors_     
The Wall Street Journal reports Hostess used employee pension money to stay afloat as it sank deeper and deeper toward bankruptcy.

IANAL - But, how can this be legal?

10 Dec 2012 03:54 PM
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unyon    [TotalFark]  
This isn't news. It was part of what the union was angry about. Outright theft. Pay attention, people.

10 Dec 2012 03:59 PM
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MaudlinMutantMollusk    [TotalFark]  

unyon: This isn't news. It was part of what the union was angry about. Outright theft. Pay attention, people.


I see my point has already been made

10 Dec 2012 04:02 PM
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ManateeGag    [TotalFark]  

unyon: This isn't news. It was part of what the union was angry about. Outright theft. Pay attention, people.


I want my farking Wonder Bread back, damn it!

10 Dec 2012 04:04 PM
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Fear_and_Loathing    [TotalFark]  
Unions suck, so does management.  They only look out for the top earners.  Neither cares about the workers.  The National head of the union still gets a paycheck, and management will get golden parachutes.

10 Dec 2012 04:06 PM
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Ambivalence    [TotalFark]  
Well yah. Were you trapped in a well when the story came out? Hostess gutted the pension and then demanded worker pay cuts (but not executive pay cuts of course), but somehow it was the union and the workers being unreasonable.

10 Dec 2012 04:08 PM
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Runs_With_Scissors_     
Forgive me, but hasn't Hostess referred to the pension as 'unfunded' and that the unions were asking for too much? This new item seems to show Hostess looting the pension fund.

It seems to me that the difference before was them lying about how much the pension would cost them in the long run (instead of focusing on the bad debt they'd created.) I must have missed the part where they were dipping into the fund directly.

Huh... There are just so many thieving companies out there it's tough to keep straight all the various ways they fleece us.

10 Dec 2012 04:11 PM
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Runs_With_Scissors_     
Hostess Brands acknowledged for the first time in a news report Monday that the company diverted workers' pension money for other company uses.

The bankrupt baker told The Wall Street Journal that money taken out of workers' paychecks, intended for their retirement funds, was used for company operations instead
. Hostess, which was under different management at the time the diversions began in August 2011, said it does not know how much money it took.


Yeah. I thought so. This is a new report. Hostess is finally admitting what the union said they had been doing.

10 Dec 2012 04:13 PM
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Jackson Herring     
This has actually been known since the very first story about this issue. Submitter should pay more attention.

10 Dec 2012 04:14 PM
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Runs_With_Scissors_     

Ambivalence: Well yah. Were you trapped in a well when the story came out? Hostess gutted the pension and then demanded worker pay cuts (but not executive pay cuts of course), but somehow it was the union and the workers being unreasonable.


unyon: This isn't news. It was part of what the union was angry about. Outright theft. Pay attention, people.


I believe you're mistaking the 'unfunded' lie with the outright theft they lied about. Either way, this is the first time that Hostess is admitting to it.

10 Dec 2012 04:16 PM
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Runs_With_Scissors_     

Jackson Herring: This has actually been known since the very first story about this issue. Submitter should pay more attention.

Nov 20, 2012:
According to an article published last summer by Fortune, labor relations at Hostess have been contentious for some time. In order to allow Hostess to come out of bankruptcy, management had wanted to cut wages by 8% this year, gradually giving back half of the cut over the next five years. In addition, management wanted to reduce its contributions to employees' health care and pensions.

The biggest issue is that Hostess' union pension funds are underfunded by $2 billion.
Under its agreements with the unions, Hostess is required to contribute to multi-employer pension plans (MEPPs). MEPPs provide pension benefits to workers within a particular trade, regardless of what company they work for. The concept was that all companies employing workers in a particular trade would contribute to the trade pension fund so that workers would not lose their pension benefits if they changed employers.


Yeah, underfunding (not putting in the money you were supposed to put in ) and stealing the funds that were put there by workers are two different things. They did both - but, they're different.

10 Dec 2012 04:22 PM
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Jackson Herring     
No, it has literally been known since the story first broke that Hostess had "borrowed" the pension money and then informed the unions that they would not be paying it back.

10 Dec 2012 04:25 PM
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Rev.K    [TotalFark]  
Nice try, libtardos. If they didn't want their pension money being used to fund operations, they should have said so.

The company can't be liable for stuff the employees don't raise.

10 Dec 2012 04:26 PM
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Jackson Herring     
Is it libtardos or libtardoes?

10 Dec 2012 04:32 PM
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Nabb1    [TotalFark]  
And that, folks, is why I won't buy any more of their stupid snack cakes.

Come to think of it, I haven't had one of their snack cakes in 20 years.

10 Dec 2012 04:44 PM
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Jubeebee     

Nabb1: And that, folks, is why I won't buy any more of their stupid snack cakes.

Come to think of it, I haven't had one of their snack cakes in 20 years.


Little Debbies are better in every way anyway.

10 Dec 2012 04:50 PM
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propasaurus    [TotalFark]  

Jackson Herring: Is it libtardos or libtardoes?


Libtardeaux

/Frenchier

10 Dec 2012 04:51 PM
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Nabb1    [TotalFark]  

Jubeebee: Nabb1: And that, folks, is why I won't buy any more of their stupid snack cakes.

Come to think of it, I haven't had one of their snack cakes in 20 years.

Little Debbies are better in every way anyway.


I used to love oatmeal cream pies until I made the mistake of reading the nutritional content not long after I turned 30. Mother of God...

10 Dec 2012 04:53 PM
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brap    [TotalFark]  
That's a jailing.
 
Somebody is going to know what it a Twinkie being made feels like.

10 Dec 2012 04:53 PM
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Jackson Herring     

propasaurus: Jackson Herring: Is it libtardos or libtardoes?

Libtardeaux

/Frenchier


i.imgur.com

10 Dec 2012 04:57 PM
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ZAZ    [TotalFark]  
WSJ: The maneuver probably doesn't violate federal law because the money Hostess failed to put into the pension didn't come directly from employees, experts said.

http://online.wsj.com/
article/SB100014241278873233168045781 65813739413332.html

(Fark doesn't like links to WSJ main page, so cut and paste and strip the newline if your browser doesn't.)

WSJ had an interesting editorial a few weeks ago pointing out that people keep overlooking that there are two unions here with competing interests: Teamsters and bakers.

10 Dec 2012 05:09 PM
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Grand_Moff_Joseph    [TotalFark]  
See, GOP? The problem with America is not the "47%", or the minorities, or the immigrants, or the gays, or the hipsters.

It's the goddamn corporatist vultures - aka - the goons who write your checks.

10 Dec 2012 05:11 PM
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Jubeebee     

Nabb1: Jubeebee: Nabb1: And that, folks, is why I won't buy any more of their stupid snack cakes.

Come to think of it, I haven't had one of their snack cakes in 20 years.

Little Debbies are better in every way anyway.

I used to love oatmeal cream pies until I made the mistake of reading the nutritional content not long after I turned 30. Mother of God...


Nope. I learned that lesson after checking out the ingredient list of some of that shelf-stable ranch dip. Now I just assume that things like that have a big label on the back of the box that says "The contents of this container cannot actively kill an otherwise healthy adult." I know whatever's in it is bad for me, and that's all I need to know, thank you very much.

10 Dec 2012 05:12 PM
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Relatively Obscure    [TotalFark]  

Nabb1: Jubeebee: Nabb1: And that, folks, is why I won't buy any more of their stupid snack cakes.

Come to think of it, I haven't had one of their snack cakes in 20 years.

Little Debbies are better in every way anyway.

I used to love oatmeal cream pies until I made the mistake of reading the nutritional content not long after I turned 30. Mother of God...


Did you somehow think that they'd be good for you?

Anyway, I can't stand 'em either, but that's mostly from overdoing it as a kid when a neighbor's mom had a truck full of 'em.

10 Dec 2012 05:18 PM
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Nabb1    [TotalFark]  

Relatively Obscure: Nabb1: Jubeebee: Nabb1: And that, folks, is why I won't buy any more of their stupid snack cakes.

Come to think of it, I haven't had one of their snack cakes in 20 years.

Little Debbies are better in every way anyway.

I used to love oatmeal cream pies until I made the mistake of reading the nutritional content not long after I turned 30. Mother of God...

Did you somehow think that they'd be good for you?


Oh, of course not. I knew they were bad for me. I just didn't know they were appallingly bad for me.

10 Dec 2012 05:19 PM
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BKITU    [TotalFark]  

Nabb1: Relatively Obscure: Nabb1: Jubeebee: Nabb1: And that, folks, is why I won't buy any more of their stupid snack cakes.

Come to think of it, I haven't had one of their snack cakes in 20 years.

Little Debbies are better in every way anyway.

I used to love oatmeal cream pies until I made the mistake of reading the nutritional content not long after I turned 30. Mother of God...

Did you somehow think that they'd be good for you?

Oh, of course not. I knew they were bad for me. I just didn't know they were appallingly bad for me.


But they have oatmeal! That cures teh diabeetus!

10 Dec 2012 05:27 PM
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FarkedOver     
Big Unions need big time restructuring. Union leaders should only make what the average employee in their union makes. I'm looking at you Jimmy Hoffa Jr.

/Some unions do, in fact, do this :)
//Pro-Union, Pro-Worker, PROLETARIAT!

10 Dec 2012 05:27 PM
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Scorpitron is reduced to a thin red paste     

Fear_and_Loathing: Unions suck, so does management.  They only look out for the top earners.  Neither cares about the workers.  The National head of the union still gets a paycheck, and management will get golden parachutes.


Gah. Idiocy is becoming a real problem in this country.

10 Dec 2012 05:30 PM
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Uranus Is Huge!     
Let's not forget that this crack management team also got 40 million bucks in FREE advertising from Talladega Nights a few years ago.

10 Dec 2012 05:30 PM
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Uzzah    [TotalFark]  
ecx.images-amazon.com

10 Dec 2012 05:31 PM
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Stone Meadow     
Okay, I haven't followed this story as well as I might have, but how is it possible for Hostess, or any other company, to reach into the union's bank account and take money out of it. My employer can direct-deposit money in my account, but can't take money out of it. I have to presume the same restrictions apply to the union's bank accounts.

IOW, never mind legality...how is this even POSSIBLE?

10 Dec 2012 05:32 PM
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BalugaJoe    [TotalFark]  
They fired one million bread truck drivers.

10 Dec 2012 05:33 PM
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itsfullofstars     
Bigger question, why did the union allow the company to control the pension? Seems like the union failed to protect the employees as well.

10 Dec 2012 05:33 PM
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mark625     
@Hostess: We're stealing from union pension funds to stay afloat. #YOLO

10 Dec 2012 05:34 PM
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Free_Chilly_Willy     
I wonder who insisted on those expensive pensions in the first place? Any ideas subby??

10 Dec 2012 05:34 PM
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someonelse     

Nabb1: And that, folks, is why I won't buy any more of their stupid snack cakes.

Come to think of it, I haven't had one of their snack cakes in 20 years.


Which is why the company was going down the tubes in the first place, I imagine. You can't blame unions when the only people who are still willing to consume your products are the suicidally insane and/or death row inmates.

10 Dec 2012 05:35 PM
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genner     

Runs_With_Scissors_: The Wall Street Journal reports Hostess used employee pension money to stay afloat as it sank deeper and deeper toward bankruptcy.

IANAL - But, how can this be legal?


It's not. I'm sure hostess will gets sued and will have to declare bankruptcy.........oh wait.

10 Dec 2012 05:36 PM
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Brick-House     
If it were not for some of the outrageous demands of the union, maybe operating costs would be more manageable

10 Dec 2012 05:36 PM
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Hobodeluxe     

Runs_With_Scissors_: The Wall Street Journal reports Hostess used employee pension money to stay afloat as it sank deeper and deeper toward bankruptcy.

IANAL - But, how can this be legal?


fascist judges

10 Dec 2012 05:36 PM
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groppet     
And the sad thing is nobody will go to jail for this.

10 Dec 2012 05:36 PM
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CygnusDarius     

Scorpitron is reduced to a thin red paste: Fear_and_Loathing: Unions suck, so does management.  They only look out for the top earners.  Neither cares about the workers.  The National head of the union still gets a paycheck, and management will get golden parachutes.

Gah. Idiocy is becoming a real problem in this country.


Problem? It's becoming the norm.

10 Dec 2012 05:36 PM
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Hobodeluxe     

Brick-House: If it were not for some of the outrageous demands of the union, maybe operating costs would be more manageable


yeah those cupcake makers were just rolling in the dough.

10 Dec 2012 05:37 PM
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Sofa King Smart     

Jubeebee: Nabb1: And that, folks, is why I won't buy any more of their stupid snack cakes.

Come to think of it, I haven't had one of their snack cakes in 20 years.

Little Debbies are better in every way anyway.


owned by hardcore 7th day adventist (fundies).

10 Dec 2012 05:37 PM
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Giltric     
Was Hostess trying to create their own Clinton surplus?

10 Dec 2012 05:37 PM
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Hobodeluxe     

CygnusDarius: Scorpitron is reduced to a thin red paste: Fear_and_Loathing: Unions suck, so does management.  They only look out for the top earners.  Neither cares about the workers.  The National head of the union still gets a paycheck, and management will get golden parachutes.

Gah. Idiocy is becoming a real problem in this country.

Problem? It's becoming the norm.


protip: Invest in Brawndo while the stock is still low.

10 Dec 2012 05:38 PM
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someonelse     

Brick-House: If it were not for some of the outrageous demands of the union, maybe operating costs would be more manageable


If it weren't for the high cost of liquor, maybe I wouldn't have to steal it from you at gunpoint.

10 Dec 2012 05:38 PM
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skullkrusher     
You agree to pay people x in wages y in benefits, you farking pay them x in wages and y in benefits. You don't get to take some of y and help support the company without permission. Period. enough is farking enough.

10 Dec 2012 05:38 PM
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RexTalionis    [TotalFark]  
The Wall Street Journal reports Hostess used employee pension money to stay afloat as it sank deeper and deeper toward bankruptcy.

It isn't clear how much money was taken from those pension funds.


Considering that in Hostess's filings with the Southern District court of New York that they owe their employee pension funds just under $2 billion dollars, then I'm going to take a wild guess and say that they stole about $2 billion dollars of pension funds from their employees.

10 Dec 2012 05:38 PM
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Man On Fire     

Scorpitron is reduced to a thin red paste: Fear_and_Loathing: Unions suck, so does management.  They only look out for the top earners.  Neither cares about the workers.  The National head of the union still gets a paycheck, and management will get golden parachutes.

Gah. Idiocy is becoming a real problem in this country.


Revamping the education system would help, but I can't tell you how, because I'm an idiot too.

10 Dec 2012 05:38 PM
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ladyfortuna     

Nabb1: Jubeebee: Nabb1: And that, folks, is why I won't buy any more of their stupid snack cakes.

Come to think of it, I haven't had one of their snack cakes in 20 years.

Little Debbies are better in every way anyway.

I used to love oatmeal cream pies until I made the mistake of reading the nutritional content not long after I turned 30. Mother of God...


I read that stuff in my early twenties and never went back, even to the Little Debbie stuff. I admit a certain fondness for ice cream and dark chocolate, but they're the only desserts allowed in my house most of the year...

Now if I only I could kick the love of craft beer as easily /sigh

10 Dec 2012 05:38 PM
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